From pilotom at bellsouth.net Thu May 10 15:09:16 2018 From: pilotom at bellsouth.net (Maribel Piloto) Date: Thu, 10 May 2018 20:09:16 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> Hi all, I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic.? Her name is Flaqui.??She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of?months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat?with not much time left so I took her home?to give?her some comfort in her final days.? When I?took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+.???I decided to keep her in my room?where I have another Leuk+ guy.? I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the?bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. Flaqui's?numbers in January 2018 were... RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOWHCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOWHGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOWMCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0)MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0)MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5)RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0)%RETIC - 1.3%RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGHWBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50)EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGHPLT - 663 K/uL (175-600)Everything else was normal I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things.? Also?giving her Vetri-DMG.?? She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole.? She's also been dewormed and got Revolution.?? Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so?last week I had bloodwork done again.? Here are the results... RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOWHCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOWHGB?8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOWMCV?39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOWMCH -?21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGHMCHC -?--- g/dL (29.0-37.5)RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0)%RETIC - 1.1%RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0)WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGHNEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGHPLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGHEverything else was normal My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere.? I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous.?? With that cat, Grayson,?I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia.? He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home?with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her?? She does not have kidney problems.? However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have? non-regenerative anaemia.?? I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. ?Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration.?In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. Any help would be appreciated.? Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days.? I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. Maribel & Flaqui. "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From swacht1946 at comcast.net Thu May 10 19:48:25 2018 From: swacht1946 at comcast.net (Sandy) Date: Thu, 10 May 2018 20:48:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp In-Reply-To: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. Hope this helps! Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Amani, Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. Thanks, Gary On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: Hi Sherri I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. Amani _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org Hi Liz The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. Here is a blurb I found about it: Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis). The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Hi everyone, Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 > On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. > > Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... > > RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW > HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) > MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) > MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) > RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) > %RETIC - 1.3% > RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH > WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) > EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH > PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) > Everything else was normal > > I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... > > RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW > HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW > MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH > MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) > RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) > %RETIC - 1.1% > RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) > WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH > NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH > PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH > Everything else was normal > > My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. > > I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. > > Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... > > > > > In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. > > > > Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. > > > > In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). > > > > > > > Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. > > Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. > > Maribel & Flaqui. > > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Thu May 10 22:02:00 2018 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Fri, 11 May 2018 03:02:00 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp In-Reply-To: <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> Message-ID: Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so very often now. Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing red cells, white cells and platelets again. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. Hope this helps! Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Amani, Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. Thanks, Gary On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: Hi Sherri I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. Amani _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org Hi Liz The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. Here is a blurb I found about it: Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis). The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Hi everyone, Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto > wrote: Hi all, I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) %RETIC - 1.3% RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) Everything else was normal I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) %RETIC - 1.1% RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH Everything else was normal My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. Maribel & Flaqui. "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pilotom at bellsouth.net Thu May 10 22:38:24 2018 From: pilotom at bellsouth.net (Maribel Piloto) Date: Thu, 10 May 2018 23:38:24 -0400 Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp In-Reply-To: References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> Message-ID: Thank you guys. Very encouraging. Now let?s see if I can get my vet to prescribe the Winstrol. I?m sending him all the things you have written. Maribel "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi > On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: > > Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so very often now. > > Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing red cells, white cells and platelets again. > > Amani > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy > Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM > To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp > > This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W > > > > Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day > > Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day > > Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day > > If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. > > If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. > > Hope this helps! Amani > > > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary > Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV > > Amani, > > Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. > > Thanks, Gary > > On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: > > Hi Sherri > > I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. > > Amani > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > Hi Liz > > The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. > > Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. > > Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. > > The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. > > Here is a blurb I found about it: > > Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. > > In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. > > When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. > > Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. > > Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. > > If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. > > The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. > > Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. > > The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis). > > The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. > > Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. > > Amani > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty > Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV > > Hi everyone, > > Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. > > Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. > http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk > > Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. > > Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 > > On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. > > Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... > > RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW > HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) > MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) > MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) > RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) > %RETIC - 1.3% > RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH > WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) > EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH > PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) > Everything else was normal > > I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... > > RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW > HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW > MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH > MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) > RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) > %RETIC - 1.1% > RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) > WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH > NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH > PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH > Everything else was normal > > My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. > > I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. > > Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... > > In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. > > Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. > > In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). > > Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. > > Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. > > Maribel & Flaqui. > > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ardyr at centurytel.net Sat May 12 16:32:35 2018 From: ardyr at centurytel.net (Ardy Robertson) Date: Sat, 12 May 2018 16:32:35 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp In-Reply-To: References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> Message-ID: <000001d3ea38$bf1e79b0$3d5b6d10$@centurytel.net> Hi Maribel, I totally agree about Zander?s Protocol being your best option, and that it needs to be started as soon as possible. One thing I might add, if it was not mentioned in the comments by Amani and Sandy is that if your vet will order it for you, they might not know of a source for it. Your vet can prescribe and order it online at www.diamondbackdrugs.com -- this is a large compounding pharmacy in Arizona, and they will ship it anywhere. Their phone number is 866-578-4420 if you want to call them. The Winstrol comes in several flavors, and forms. I believe it was around $40 when I used it for my Tigger. Best wishes to you and Flaqui. Ardy From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Maribel Piloto Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 10:38 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp Thank you guys. Very encouraging. Now let?s see if I can get my vet to prescribe the Winstrol. I?m sending him all the things you have written. Maribel "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley > wrote: Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so very often now. Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing red cells, white cells and platelets again. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. Hope this helps! Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Amani, Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. Thanks, Gary On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: Hi Sherri I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. Amani _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org Hi Liz The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. Here is a blurb I found about it: Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis). The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Hi everyone, Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto > wrote: Hi all, I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) %RETIC - 1.3% RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) Everything else was normal I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) %RETIC - 1.1% RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH Everything else was normal My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. Maribel & Flaqui. "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pilotom at bellsouth.net Sat May 12 16:41:10 2018 From: pilotom at bellsouth.net (Maribel Piloto) Date: Sat, 12 May 2018 17:41:10 -0400 Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp In-Reply-To: <000001d3ea38$bf1e79b0$3d5b6d10$@centurytel.net> References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> <000001d3ea38$bf1e79b0$3d5b6d10$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Thank you everyone. Vet was impressed with all your e-mails and agreed to get me the Winstrol and other two meds. We?re trying to get it from a local pharmacy but if not, Roadrunner apparently has it. One question - how soon after I start this drug regimen should I have bloodwork done on Flaqui to see if it?s working? Maribel "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi > On May 12, 2018, at 5:32 PM, Ardy Robertson wrote: > > Hi Maribel, > I totally agree about Zander?s Protocol being your best option, and that it needs to be started as soon as possible. One thing I might add, if it was not mentioned in the comments by Amani and Sandy is that if your vet will order it for you, they might not know of a source for it. Your vet can prescribe and order it online at www.diamondbackdrugs.com -- this is a large compounding pharmacy in Arizona, and they will ship it anywhere. Their phone number is 866-578-4420 if you want to call them. The Winstrol comes in several flavors, and forms. I believe it was around $40 when I used it for my Tigger. Best wishes to you and Flaqui. > Ardy > > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Maribel Piloto > Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 10:38 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp > > Thank you guys. Very encouraging. Now let?s see if I can get my vet to prescribe the Winstrol. I?m sending him all the things you have written. > > Maribel > > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > > On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: > > Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so very often now. > > Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing red cells, white cells and platelets again. > > Amani > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy > Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM > To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp > > This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W > > > > Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day > > Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day > > Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day > > If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. > > If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. > > Hope this helps! Amani > > > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary > Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV > > Amani, > > Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. > > Thanks, Gary > > On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: > > Hi Sherri > > I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. > > Amani > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > Hi Liz > > The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. > > Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. > > Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. > > The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. > > Here is a blurb I found about it: > > Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. > > In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. > > When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. > > Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. > > Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. > > If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. > > The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. > > Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. > > The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis). > > The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. > > Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. > > Amani > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty > Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV > > Hi everyone, > > Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. > > Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. > http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk > > Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. > > Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 > > On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. > > Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... > > RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW > HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) > MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) > MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) > RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) > %RETIC - 1.3% > RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH > WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) > EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH > PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) > Everything else was normal > > I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... > > RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW > HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW > MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH > MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) > RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) > %RETIC - 1.1% > RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) > WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH > NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH > PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH > Everything else was normal > > My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. > > I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. > > Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... > > In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. > > Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. > > In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). > > Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. > > Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. > > Maribel & Flaqui. > > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ardyr at centurytel.net Sat May 12 16:52:25 2018 From: ardyr at centurytel.net (Ardy Robertson) Date: Sat, 12 May 2018 16:52:25 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp In-Reply-To: References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> <000001d3ea38$bf1e79b0$3d5b6d10$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: <001501d3ea3b$84c7c110$8e574330$@centurytel.net> Maribel, When I gave it to Tigger, the results were very fast ? within days ? so much so that the lab re-ran his results, thinking they must have made a mistake the first time around and that he was not as flat-lined as they had originally thought. Amani is the expert in the lab results though and she can tell you the best time to do the follow up blood work. Ardy From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Maribel Piloto Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2018 4:41 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp Thank you everyone. Vet was impressed with all your e-mails and agreed to get me the Winstrol and other two meds. We?re trying to get it from a local pharmacy but if not, Roadrunner apparently has it. One question - how soon after I start this drug regimen should I have bloodwork done on Flaqui to see if it?s working? Maribel "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi On May 12, 2018, at 5:32 PM, Ardy Robertson > wrote: Hi Maribel, I totally agree about Zander?s Protocol being your best option, and that it needs to be started as soon as possible. One thing I might add, if it was not mentioned in the comments by Amani and Sandy is that if your vet will order it for you, they might not know of a source for it. Your vet can prescribe and order it online at www.diamondbackdrugs.com -- this is a large compounding pharmacy in Arizona, and they will ship it anywhere. Their phone number is 866-578-4420 if you want to call them. The Winstrol comes in several flavors, and forms. I believe it was around $40 when I used it for my Tigger. Best wishes to you and Flaqui. Ardy From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Maribel Piloto Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2018 10:38 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp Thank you guys. Very encouraging. Now let?s see if I can get my vet to prescribe the Winstrol. I?m sending him all the things you have written. Maribel "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley > wrote: Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so very often now. Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing red cells, white cells and platelets again. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. Hope this helps! Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Amani, Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. Thanks, Gary On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: Hi Sherri I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. Amani _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org Hi Liz The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. Here is a blurb I found about it: Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis). The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Hi everyone, Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto > wrote: Hi all, I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) %RETIC - 1.3% RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) Everything else was normal I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) %RETIC - 1.1% RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH Everything else was normal My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. Maribel & Flaqui. "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pilotom at bellsouth.net Sun May 13 00:43:43 2018 From: pilotom at bellsouth.net (Maribel Piloto) Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 01:43:43 -0400 Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp In-Reply-To: References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> Message-ID: <4371704D-888F-47A3-9163-24187C4939E8@bellsouth.net> Hi Amani and everyone else who?s been helping me with this post - I shared the recommended drug protocol with a friend of mine who isn?t a vet but has worked for years in animal rescue and has also worked at both the local Humane Society and the local county shelter. She also attends a lot of vet conferences. She sent me the following... > If your vet is willing to prescribe this regimen, I'd give it a try with one CRITICAL CHANGE. NEVER use doxycycline tablets/capsules with cats as doxy can cause esophageal strictures. You can get compounded doxycycline is 50 mg/ml, so dose would be 0.4 - 0.5 ml twice a day. Do you foresee any issues with using the Doxy in liquid format? I also wanted to get the Prednisolone in liquid as Flaqui is very difficult to pill. Thanks Maribel "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi > On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: > > Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so very often now. > > Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing red cells, white cells and platelets again. > > Amani > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy > Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM > To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp > > This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W > > > > Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day > > Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day > > Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day > > If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. > > If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. > > Hope this helps! Amani > > > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary > Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV > > Amani, > > Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. > > Thanks, Gary > > On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: > > Hi Sherri > > I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. > > Amani > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > Hi Liz > > The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. > > Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. > > Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. > > The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. > > Here is a blurb I found about it: > > Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. > > In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. > > When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. > > Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. > > Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. > > If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. > > The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. > > Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. > > The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis). > > The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. > > Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. > > Amani > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty > Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV > > Hi everyone, > > Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. > > Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. > http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk > > Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. > > Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 > > On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. > > Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... > > RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW > HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) > MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) > MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) > RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) > %RETIC - 1.3% > RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH > WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) > EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH > PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) > Everything else was normal > > I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... > > RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW > HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW > MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH > MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) > RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) > %RETIC - 1.1% > RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) > WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH > NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH > PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH > Everything else was normal > > My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. > > I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. > > Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... > > In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. > > Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. > > In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). > > Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. > > Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. > > Maribel & Flaqui. > > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Sun May 13 00:45:28 2018 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 05:45:28 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp In-Reply-To: <4371704D-888F-47A3-9163-24187C4939E8@bellsouth.net> References: <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2138741583.2182024.1525982957005@mail.yahoo.com> <758541374.118203.1525999705382@connect.xfinity.com> <4371704D-888F-47A3-9163-24187C4939E8@bellsouth.net> Message-ID: There is no problem with the recommended change. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Maribel Piloto Sent: May-13-18 1:44 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp Hi Amani and everyone else who?s been helping me with this post - I shared the recommended drug protocol with a friend of mine who isn?t a vet but has worked for years in animal rescue and has also worked at both the local Humane Society and the local county shelter. She also attends a lot of vet conferences. She sent me the following... If your vet is willing to prescribe this regimen, I'd give it a try with one CRITICAL CHANGE. NEVER use doxycycline tablets/capsules with cats as doxy can cause esophageal strictures. You can get compounded doxycycline is 50 mg/ml, so dose would be 0.4 - 0.5 ml twice a day. Do you foresee any issues with using the Doxy in liquid format? I also wanted to get the Prednisolone in liquid as Flaqui is very difficult to pill. Thanks Maribel "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley > wrote: Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so very often now. Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing red cells, white cells and platelets again. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. Hope this helps! Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Amani, Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. Thanks, Gary On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: Hi Sherri I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. Amani _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org Hi Liz The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. Here is a blurb I found about it: Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis). The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV Hi everyone, Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto > wrote: Hi all, I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) %RETIC - 1.3% RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) Everything else was normal I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) %RETIC - 1.1% RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH Everything else was normal My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. Maribel & Flaqui. "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bchapel at optonline.net Sun May 13 13:21:50 2018 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 14:21:50 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Reconstituted Doxy In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> My recollection re: the stand against Doxy Tabs is that they are often large and hard to get all the way down the cats throat without getting stuck....?? I DO apologize that it's been so long?since I was giving my cats Doxy in pill form successfully( had found a coated small pill).... but... if you can afford it ...diamondback drugs can formulate tasty chewies with Doxy that many cats love ( mine ate them down with relish)? Believe Sandy might be able to weigh in on this??.... Don't have experience with liquid form... but be assured there iis always a way a drug can be administered to a cat... if one has the time,?ability and funds....?? The chewies are not cheap.... Bob in Warwick NY ? ? ?On Sun, May 13, 2018 at 01:44 AM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: ? ?> Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to > felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Anemia and Aranesp (Maribel Piloto) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 01:43:43 -0400 > From: Maribel Piloto > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp > Message-ID: <4371704D-888F-47A3-9163-24187C4939E8 at bellsouth.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Hi Amani and everyone else who?s been helping me with this post - I > shared the recommended drug protocol with a friend of mine who isn?t a > vet but has worked for years in animal rescue and has also worked at > both the local Humane Society and the local county shelter. She also > attends a lot of vet conferences. She sent me the following... > >> If your vet is willing to prescribe this regimen, I'd give it a try >> with one CRITICAL CHANGE. NEVER use doxycycline tablets/capsules >> with cats as doxy can cause esophageal strictures. You can get >> compounded doxycycline is 50 mg/ml, so dose would be 0.4 - 0.5 ml >> twice a day. > > Do you foresee any issues with using the Doxy in liquid format? I > also wanted to get the Prednisolone in liquid as Flaqui is very > difficult to pill. > > Thanks > Maribel > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are > treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > >> On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so >> very often now. >> Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the >> effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because >> erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With >> FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three >> cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken >> over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can >> no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The >> erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them >> to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer >> do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the >> very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, >> etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, >> the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing >> red cells, white cells and platelets again. >> Amani >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On >> Behalf Of Sandy >> Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM >> To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp >> This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but >> your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this >> will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - >> BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will >> probably get more responses - Sandy W >> >> >> Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day >> >> Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day >> >> Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day >> >> If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, >> slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be >> indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try >> adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. >> >> If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you >> might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, >> to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to >> be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, >> recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. >> >> Hope this helps! Amani >> >> >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On >> Behalf Of gary >> Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV >> >> Amani, >> >> Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know >> they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. >> >> Thanks, Gary >> >> On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> Hi Sherri >> >> I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my >> experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the >> red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use >> of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol >> does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger >> overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment >> regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and >> reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. >> >> Amani >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> Hi Liz >> >> The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is >> Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most >> steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a >> corticosteroid. >> >> Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. >> >> Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on >> right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to >> slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by >> interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping >> inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red >> cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow >> and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least >> it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several >> people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw >> almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? >> gums/ears/pads pinkening up. >> >> The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is >> also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and >> faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the >> Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on >> its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is >> the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema >> and anemia. >> >> Here is a blurb I found about it: >> >> Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based >> Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, >> in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that >> started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. >> >> In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. >> But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only >> promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a >> termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American >> market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only >> survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its >> use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to >> boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial >> swelling or angioedema. >> >> When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation >> Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. >> However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so >> the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are >> only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, >> several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. >> >> Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because >> it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These >> particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed >> for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. >> >> Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses >> as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in >> order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate >> appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used >> to dope horses in US horse races. >> >> If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from >> a compounding pharmacy. >> >> The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in >> poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times >> a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. >> >> Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver >> damage. >> >> The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably >> result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is >> directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may >> not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you >> are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct >> attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the >> interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages >> to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try >> and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then >> MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells >> in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. >> Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I >> have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor >> cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also >> works to enhance the production of bone cells (effe > ctive against osteoporosis). >> >> The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only >> information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly >> designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses >> found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were >> given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than >> 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study >> which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. >> And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the >> cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) >> and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol >> was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I >> refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, >> because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I >> kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were >> in a normal range. During that ten month per > iod, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells > would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was > the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol > pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went > right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO > lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a > nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up > and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at > the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I > weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off > the Winstrol. >> >> Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the >> prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the >> Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. >> >> Amani >> >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of Liz McCarty >> Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV >> >> Hi everyone, >> >> Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a >> cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he >> seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was >> red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely >> anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and >> rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an >> FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra >> tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and >> persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which >> was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was >> going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We >> went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks >> now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial >> cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone >> have experience with that and know if it was effective? > I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight > into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't > have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone > marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they > are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. > She's not FeLV positive. >> >> Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we >> incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is >> interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk >> >> Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. >> >> Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 >> >> On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto wrote: >> >> Hi all, >> I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. >> She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago >> (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat >> with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort >> in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she >> isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep >> her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little >> catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy >> the outside. >> Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... >> RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW >> HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW >> HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW >> MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) >> MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) >> MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) >> RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) >> %RETIC - 1.3% >> RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH >> WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) >> EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH >> PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) >> Everything else was normal >> I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron >> and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She >> initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with >> Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. >> Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing >> weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here >> are the results... >> RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW >> HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW >> HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW >> MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW >> MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH >> MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) >> RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) >> %RETIC - 1.1% >> RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) >> WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH >> NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH >> PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH >> Everything else was normal >> My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell >> count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was >> really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic >> renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT >> numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, >> Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He >> eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his >> anemia at bay. >> I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to >> do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood >> transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I >> manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs >> including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I >> just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. >> Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? >> She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the >> reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. >> I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic >> Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be >> adjusted based on PCV... >> In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in >> percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of >> anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as >> many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. >> Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte >> count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then >> divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many >> laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of >> 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. >> In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte >> count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also >> indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the >> corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). >> Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 >> = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. >> Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the >> last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish >> I could improve those HCT numbers. >> Maribel & Flaqui. >> "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are >> treated." >> -Mohandas Ghandi >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 46, Issue 7 > *************************************** > From pilotom at bellsouth.net Sun May 13 14:45:50 2018 From: pilotom at bellsouth.net (Maribel Piloto) Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 15:45:50 -0400 Subject: [Felvtalk] Reconstituted Doxy In-Reply-To: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> References: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> Message-ID: <5450E481-D44E-4EE7-96B4-DD707291453C@bellsouth.net> Thanks Bob and everyone else. Flaqui "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi > On May 13, 2018, at 2:21 PM, ROBERT CHAPEL wrote: > > My recollection re: the stand against Doxy Tabs is that they are often large and hard to get all the way down the cats throat without getting stuck.... I DO apologize that it's been so long since I was giving my cats Doxy in pill form successfully( had found a coated small pill).... but... if you can afford it ...diamondback drugs can formulate tasty chewies with Doxy that many cats love ( mine ate them down with relish) Believe Sandy might be able to weigh in on this??.... Don't have experience with liquid form... but be assured there iis always a way a drug can be administered to a cat... if one has the time, ability and funds.... The chewies are not cheap.... > > Bob in Warwick NY > > > On Sun, May 13, 2018 at 01:44 AM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: > > > Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to >> felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> 1. Re: Anemia and Aranesp (Maribel Piloto) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 01:43:43 -0400 >> From: Maribel Piloto > >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp >> Message-ID: <4371704D-888F-47A3-9163-24187C4939E8 at bellsouth.net> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Hi Amani and everyone else who?s been helping me with this post - I shared the recommended drug protocol with a friend of mine who isn?t a vet but has worked for years in animal rescue and has also worked at both the local Humane Society and the local county shelter. She also attends a lot of vet conferences. She sent me the following... >> >>> If your vet is willing to prescribe this regimen, I'd give it a try with one CRITICAL CHANGE. NEVER use doxycycline tablets/capsules with cats as doxy can cause esophageal strictures. You can get compounded doxycycline is 50 mg/ml, so dose would be 0.4 - 0.5 ml twice a day. >> >> Do you foresee any issues with using the Doxy in liquid format? I also wanted to get the Prednisolone in liquid as Flaqui is very difficult to pill. >> >> Thanks >> Maribel >> "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." >> -Mohandas Ghandi >> >>> On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: >>> >>> Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so very often now. >>> Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing red cells, white cells and platelets again. >>> Amani >>> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy >>> Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM >>> To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp >>> This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will probably get more responses - Sandy W >>> >>> >>> Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day >>> >>> Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day >>> >>> Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day >>> >>> If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. >>> >>> If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. >>> >>> Hope this helps! Amani >>> >>> >>> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of gary >>> Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM >>> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV >>> >>> Amani, >>> >>> Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. >>> >>> Thanks, Gary >>> >>> On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: >>> >>> Hi Sherri >>> >>> I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. >>> >>> Amani >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> Hi Liz >>> >>> The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a corticosteroid. >>> >>> Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. >>> >>> Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? gums/ears/pads pinkening up. >>> >>> The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema and anemia. >>> >>> Here is a blurb I found about it: >>> >>> Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. >>> >>> In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial swelling or angioedema. >>> >>> When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. >>> >>> Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. >>> >>> Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. >>> >>> If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a compounding pharmacy. >>> >>> The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. >>> >>> Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. >>> >>> The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effe >> ctive against osteoporosis). >>> >>> The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month per >> iod, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off the Winstrol. >>> >>> Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. >>> >>> Amani >>> >>> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Liz McCarty >>> Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM >>> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV >>> >>> Hi everyone, >>> >>> Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone have experience with that and know if it was effective? >> I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. She's not FeLV positive. >>> >>> Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk >>> >>> Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. >>> >>> Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 >>> >>> On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto > wrote: >>> >>> Hi all, >>> I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy the outside. >>> Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... >>> RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW >>> HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW >>> HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW >>> MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) >>> MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) >>> MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) >>> RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) >>> %RETIC - 1.3% >>> RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH >>> WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) >>> EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH >>> PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) >>> Everything else was normal >>> I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here are the results... >>> RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW >>> HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW >>> HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW >>> MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW >>> MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH >>> MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) >>> RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) >>> %RETIC - 1.1% >>> RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) >>> WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH >>> NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH >>> PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH >>> Everything else was normal >>> My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his anemia at bay. >>> I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. >>> Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be adjusted based on PCV... >>> In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. >>> Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. >>> In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). >>> Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. >>> Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish I could improve those HCT numbers. >>> Maribel & Flaqui. >>> "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." >>> -Mohandas Ghandi >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: >> ------------------------------ >> >> Subject: Digest Footer >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 46, Issue 7 >> *************************************** >> > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From thyme2sail at gmail.com Sun May 13 17:25:54 2018 From: thyme2sail at gmail.com (Pam Doore) Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 18:25:54 -0400 Subject: [Felvtalk] Reconstituted Doxy In-Reply-To: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> References: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> Message-ID: We usually givery Doxycycline liquid at the shelter. If given in pill form water has to be forced down throat as well because of issues with damage to esophagus. I have never heard of doxy as a chewy treat. That is great. My default is transdermal :-). On Sun, May 13, 2018, 2:22 PM ROBERT CHAPEL wrote: > My recollection re: the stand against Doxy Tabs is that they are often > large and hard to get all the way down the cats throat without getting > stuck.... I DO apologize that it's been so long since I was giving my > cats Doxy in pill form successfully( had found a coated small pill).... > but... if you can afford it ...diamondback drugs can formulate tasty > chewies with Doxy that many cats love ( mine ate them down with relish) > Believe Sandy might be able to weigh in on this??.... Don't have > experience with liquid form... but be assured there iis always a way a > drug can be administered to a cat... if one has the time, ability and > funds.... The chewies are not cheap.... > > Bob in Warwick NY > > > On Sun, May 13, 2018 at 01:44 AM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > wrote: > > > Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to > > felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > > felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > 1. Re: Anemia and Aranesp (Maribel Piloto) > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 01:43:43 -0400 > > From: Maribel Piloto > > > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp > > Message-ID: <4371704D-888F-47A3-9163-24187C4939E8 at bellsouth.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > > > Hi Amani and everyone else who?s been helping me with this post - I > > shared the recommended drug protocol with a friend of mine who isn?t a > > vet but has worked for years in animal rescue and has also worked at > > both the local Humane Society and the local county shelter. She also > > attends a lot of vet conferences. She sent me the following... > > > >> If your vet is willing to prescribe this regimen, I'd give it a try > >> with one CRITICAL CHANGE. NEVER use doxycycline tablets/capsules > >> with cats as doxy can cause esophageal strictures. You can get > >> compounded doxycycline is 50 mg/ml, so dose would be 0.4 - 0.5 ml > >> twice a day. > > > > Do you foresee any issues with using the Doxy in liquid format? I > > also wanted to get the Prednisolone in liquid as Flaqui is very > > difficult to pill. > > > > Thanks > > Maribel > > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are > > treated." > > -Mohandas Ghandi > > > >> On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: > >> > >> Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so > >> very often now. > >> Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the > >> effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because > >> erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With > >> FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three > >> cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken > >> over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can > >> no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The > >> erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them > >> to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer > >> do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the > >> very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, > >> etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, > >> the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing > >> red cells, white cells and platelets again. > >> Amani > >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On > >> Behalf Of Sandy > >> Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM > >> To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp > >> This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but > >> your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this > >> will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - > >> BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will > >> probably get more responses - Sandy W > >> > >> > >> Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day > >> > >> Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day > >> > >> Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day > >> > >> If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, > >> slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be > >> indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try > >> adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. > >> > >> If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you > >> might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, > >> to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to > >> be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, > >> recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. > >> > >> Hope this helps! Amani > >> > >> > >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On > >> Behalf Of gary > >> Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM > >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV > >> > >> Amani, > >> > >> Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know > >> they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. > >> > >> Thanks, Gary > >> > >> On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: > >> > >> Hi Sherri > >> > >> I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my > >> experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the > >> red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use > >> of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol > >> does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger > >> overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment > >> regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and > >> reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. > >> > >> Amani > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Felvtalk mailing list > >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > >> > >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > >> > >> Hi Liz > >> > >> The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is > >> Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most > >> steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a > >> corticosteroid. > >> > >> Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. > >> > >> Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on > >> right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to > >> slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by > >> interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping > >> inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red > >> cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow > >> and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least > >> it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several > >> people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw > >> almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? > >> gums/ears/pads pinkening up. > >> > >> The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is > >> also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and > >> faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the > >> Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on > >> its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is > >> the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema > >> and anemia. > >> > >> Here is a blurb I found about it: > >> > >> Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based > >> Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, > >> in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that > >> started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. > >> > >> In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. > >> But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only > >> promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a > >> termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American > >> market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only > >> survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its > >> use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to > >> boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial > >> swelling or angioedema. > >> > >> When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation > >> Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. > >> However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so > >> the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are > >> only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, > >> several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. > >> > >> Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because > >> it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These > >> particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed > >> for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. > >> > >> Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses > >> as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in > >> order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate > >> appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used > >> to dope horses in US horse races. > >> > >> If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from > >> a compounding pharmacy. > >> > >> The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in > >> poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times > >> a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. > >> > >> Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver > >> damage. > >> > >> The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably > >> result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is > >> directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may > >> not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you > >> are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct > >> attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the > >> interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages > >> to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try > >> and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then > >> MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells > >> in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. > >> Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I > >> have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor > >> cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also > >> works to enhance the production of bone cells (effe > > ctive against osteoporosis). > >> > >> The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only > >> information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly > >> designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses > >> found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were > >> given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than > >> 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study > >> which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. > >> And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the > >> cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) > >> and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol > >> was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I > >> refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, > >> because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I > >> kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were > >> in a normal range. During that ten month per > > iod, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells > > would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was > > the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol > > pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went > > right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO > > lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a > > nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up > > and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at > > the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I > > weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off > > the Winstrol. > >> > >> Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the > >> prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the > >> Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. > >> > >> Amani > >> > >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > >> Of Liz McCarty > >> Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM > >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > >> Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV > >> > >> Hi everyone, > >> > >> Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a > >> cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he > >> seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was > >> red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely > >> anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and > >> rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an > >> FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra > >> tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and > >> persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which > >> was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was > >> going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We > >> went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks > >> now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial > >> cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone > >> have experience with that and know if it was effective? > > I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight > > into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't > > have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone > > marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they > > are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. > > She's not FeLV positive. > >> > >> Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we > >> incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is > >> interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk > >> > >> Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. > >> > >> Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 > >> > >> On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto > wrote: > >> > >> Hi all, > >> I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. > >> She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago > >> (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat > >> with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort > >> in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she > >> isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep > >> her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little > >> catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy > >> the outside. > >> Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... > >> RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > >> HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW > >> HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > >> MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) > >> MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) > >> MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) > >> RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) > >> %RETIC - 1.3% > >> RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH > >> WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) > >> EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH > >> PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) > >> Everything else was normal > >> I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron > >> and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She > >> initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with > >> Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. > >> Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing > >> weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here > >> are the results... > >> RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW > >> HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW > >> HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW > >> MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW > >> MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH > >> MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) > >> RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) > >> %RETIC - 1.1% > >> RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) > >> WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH > >> NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH > >> PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH > >> Everything else was normal > >> My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell > >> count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was > >> really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic > >> renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT > >> numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, > >> Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He > >> eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his > >> anemia at bay. > >> I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to > >> do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood > >> transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I > >> manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs > >> including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I > >> just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. > >> Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? > >> She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the > >> reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. > >> I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic > >> Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be > >> adjusted based on PCV... > >> In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in > >> percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of > >> anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as > >> many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. > >> Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte > >> count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then > >> divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many > >> laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of > >> 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. > >> In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte > >> count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also > >> indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the > >> corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). > >> Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 > >> = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. > >> Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the > >> last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish > >> I could improve those HCT numbers. > >> Maribel & Flaqui. > >> "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are > >> treated." > >> -Mohandas Ghandi > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Felvtalk mailing list > >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > >> > >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Felvtalk mailing list > >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > >> > >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > -------------- next part -------------- > > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > > URL: > > ------------------------------ > > > > Subject: Digest Footer > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 46, Issue 7 > > *************************************** > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Sun May 13 18:38:05 2018 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 23:38:05 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Reconstituted Doxy In-Reply-To: References: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> Message-ID: If you scrape the pill through butter, thus coating it with a bit of butter, this helps ensure it doesn?t get stuck. I have never had an issue with the pills, with or without the butter trick, but I have heard that this has happened, and so, vets are a bit more cautious in this regard. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Pam Doore Sent: May-13-18 6:26 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Reconstituted Doxy We usually givery Doxycycline liquid at the shelter. If given in pill form water has to be forced down throat as well because of issues with damage to esophagus. I have never heard of doxy as a chewy treat. That is great. My default is transdermal :-). On Sun, May 13, 2018, 2:22 PM ROBERT CHAPEL > wrote: My recollection re: the stand against Doxy Tabs is that they are often large and hard to get all the way down the cats throat without getting stuck.... I DO apologize that it's been so long since I was giving my cats Doxy in pill form successfully( had found a coated small pill).... but... if you can afford it ...diamondback drugs can formulate tasty chewies with Doxy that many cats love ( mine ate them down with relish) Believe Sandy might be able to weigh in on this??.... Don't have experience with liquid form... but be assured there iis always a way a drug can be administered to a cat... if one has the time, ability and funds.... The chewies are not cheap.... Bob in Warwick NY On Sun, May 13, 2018 at 01:44 AM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: > Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to > felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Anemia and Aranesp (Maribel Piloto) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 13 May 2018 01:43:43 -0400 > From: Maribel Piloto > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp > Message-ID: <4371704D-888F-47A3-9163-24187C4939E8 at bellsouth.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Hi Amani and everyone else who?s been helping me with this post - I > shared the recommended drug protocol with a friend of mine who isn?t a > vet but has worked for years in animal rescue and has also worked at > both the local Humane Society and the local county shelter. She also > attends a lot of vet conferences. She sent me the following... > >> If your vet is willing to prescribe this regimen, I'd give it a try >> with one CRITICAL CHANGE. NEVER use doxycycline tablets/capsules >> with cats as doxy can cause esophageal strictures. You can get >> compounded doxycycline is 50 mg/ml, so dose would be 0.4 - 0.5 ml >> twice a day. > > Do you foresee any issues with using the Doxy in liquid format? I > also wanted to get the Prednisolone in liquid as Flaqui is very > difficult to pill. > > Thanks > Maribel > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are > treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > >> On May 10, 2018, at 11:02 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> Thank you Sandy. You saved me from repeating what I have posted so >> very often now. >> Mirabel, regarding the Aranesp, it is a product which mimics the >> effects of erythropoietin. I do not believe it will assist because >> erythropoietin tells the bone marrow to produce more red cells. With >> FeLV, it infects the cells in the bone marrow which produce all three >> cell lines (red cells, white cells, platelets). The cells are taken >> over and destroyed by the virus, which means that the bone marrow can >> no longer produce red cells, white cells and/or platelets. The >> erythropoietin or Aranesp is speaking to these cells and telling them >> to churn out more red cells, but the bone marrow cells can no longer >> do that. My experience with the Winstrol is that after my cat had the >> very worst results (HAEMATOCRIT OF FIVE!!!, ZERO % RETICULOCYTES, >> etc.) and AFTER I had given him several bouts of blood transfusions, >> the Winstrol turned back on the bone marrow and he began producing >> red cells, white cells and platelets again. >> Amani >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On >> Behalf Of Sandy >> Sent: May-10-18 8:48 PM >> To: Maribel Piloto; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Anemia and Aranesp >> This is long because I just copied this whole conversation - but >> your answer lies in this combination of drugs - make no mistake this >> will work if your vet will give it a try - there is nothing to lose - >> BUT you and the vet need to act immediately. - good luck. You will >> probably get more responses - Sandy W >> >> >> Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day >> >> Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day >> >> Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day >> >> If there are problems with the intestines (vomiting, constipation, >> slow moving stools, stools of large diameters, all of which might be >> indicative of the effect of the virus on the intestines) you can try >> adding ? tablet of apometocloprimide. >> >> If the haematocrit level is REALLY REALLY low ? like below 5-8, you >> might consider starting the Winstrol at 2 mg twice a day for a week, >> to try and kickstart things quickly, but given that there is going to >> be a likely increase in liver enzymes with the use of Winstrol, >> recognize that this might also increase the liver enzymes faster. >> >> Hope this helps! Amani >> >> >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On >> Behalf Of gary >> Sent: January-27-17 4:04 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV >> >> Amani, >> >> Could you please give the dosages used for Zander's Protocol? I know >> they must have been previously given, but I cannot seem to find them. >> >> Thanks, Gary >> >> On 9/16/2016 8:52 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> Hi Sherri >> >> I hope you got some good news today. However, as you know, my >> experience is that the Winstrol needs to be used long term before the >> red cells are back into the normal range. I continue to recommend use >> of the Doxycyline to interfere with viral RNA synthesis. The Winstrol >> does not attack the virus, though I believe it makes the cat stronger >> overall and able to fight back. But at the outset of the treatment >> regime, I believe you must have the Doxycycline on board to try and >> reduce the viral load, or at least, keep it from rising. >> >> Amani >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> Hi Liz >> >> The only thing that works to turn back on red cell production is >> Winstrol (Stanazolol). It is an ANABOLIC steroid (as opposed to most >> steroids we are used to getting, like prednisone, which is a >> corticosteroid. >> >> Anabolic steroids are ones which build muscle, tissue, etc. >> >> Adding Winstrol to the combination of medication you have your cat on >> right now, would be the best thing to do. The Doxycycline acts to >> slow down or inhibit the reproduction of the FeLV virus by >> interfering the RNA duplication. The prednisone is helpful in keeping >> inflammation at bay, but neither of these helps to increase the red >> cells. The Winstrol acts directly and very quickly on the bone marrow >> and seems to get red cells generated again, quite promptly. At least >> it did for my Zander, and I have been contacted directly by several >> people from this group, who have reported to me that they also saw >> almost immediate (within 3 days) evidence of their cats? >> gums/ears/pads pinkening up. >> >> The problem is that Winstrol is a controversial drug because it is >> also what professional athletes use to get bigger, stronger and >> faster. Quite unfortunately (since none of our cats are entering the >> Olympics) that association with doping scandals has cast a shadow on >> its use in both animal and people medicine. In human medicine, it is >> the only drug found to be effective in treating hereditary angioedema >> and anemia. >> >> Here is a blurb I found about it: >> >> Winstrol was first invented in 1959. Soon after that, the UK based >> Winthrop Laboratories created a prescription medicine from it. Later, >> in 1961, Winthrop?s patent was bought by the US based Sterling that >> started manufacturing and selling the drug in the American markets. >> >> In the beginning, Winstrol was used for a variety of medical reasons. >> But later, by the 1970s, the FDA had restricted its use to only >> promoting growth and treating osteoporosis. In the 1980s, there was a >> termination of the manufacture of anabolic steroids in the American >> market. But Winstrol was among those steroids which not only >> survived, but thrived in the 1980s and 1990s. During this period, its >> use was reinforced as a cure for anemia ? as it had the power to >> boost red blood cell count, and was used as a treatment for facial >> swelling or angioedema. >> >> When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation >> Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. >> However, Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so >> the Winstrol products available today in the American markets are >> only generic and not pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, >> several large brands still manufacture and sell Winstrol. >> >> Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because >> it separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These >> particles will fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed >> for a few hours. The crystals have a milky white color. >> >> Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses >> as well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in >> order to promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate >> appetite, and enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used >> to dope horses in US horse races. >> >> If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from >> a compounding pharmacy. >> >> The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in >> poor shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times >> a day for a week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose. >> >> Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver >> damage. >> >> The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably >> result in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is >> directly effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may >> not assist but such a treatment is again a side treatment where you >> are hoping to boost your cat?s immune system, rather than a direct >> attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in that IF the >> interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages >> to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat?s system to try >> and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then >> MAYBE (if the virus hasn?t already destroyed all the progenitor cells >> in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to climb again. >> Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe me, I >> have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor >> cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also >> works to enhance the production of bone cells (effe > ctive against osteoporosis). >> >> The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only >> information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly >> designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses >> found effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord?s sake! The cats were >> given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg ? more than >> 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. That?s the only study >> which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. >> And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the >> cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) >> and the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol >> was discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I >> refused to stop the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, >> because he was going to die with the low red cell count he had. I >> kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before the red cells were >> in a normal range. During that ten month per > iod, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells > would immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was > the Winstrol making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol > pretty much for the duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went > right back to normal again, once I discontinued the Winstrol ? NO > lasting damage. This was also my experience with a second cat with a > nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to keep her appetite up > and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went quite high at > the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal when I > weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her off > the Winstrol. >> >> Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the >> prednisone (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the >> Winstrol is used) and Doxycycline. >> >> Amani >> >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of Liz McCarty >> Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV >> >> Hi everyone, >> >> Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a >> cat with FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he >> seemed lethargic and in his stool there was a piece of floss that was >> red. At the vet things escalated and they told us he was severely >> anemic and would need a transfusion that day. I took off work and >> rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us she would run an >> FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the extra >> tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and >> persistently talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which >> was out of the question for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was >> going to be minor and then she's talking to me about killing him! We >> went forward with the blood transfusion. It's been almost 3 weeks >> now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a bacterial >> cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone >> have experience with that and know if it was effective? > I also started him on Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight > into whether you think he will be able to pull through? He doesn't > have cancer, they ran the tests but don't know if it's in the bone > marrow. I'm scared. We have another one year old, unrelated, and they > are best friends. It breaks my heart to think they might be separated. > She's not FeLV positive. >> >> Additionally I have set up a go fund me to help with the costs we >> incurred, and I want to donate half to FeLV research if anyone is >> interested. http://www.gofundme.com/2mzdpgk >> >> Mainly looking for support and advice. Thank you in advance. >> >> Elizabeth McCarty, ASW #36438 >> >> On May 10, 2018 at 4:09 PM Maribel Piloto wrote: >> >> Hi all, >> I have a Leuk+ girl who is getting very anemic. Her name is Flaqui. >> She showed up at one of the colonies I feed a couple of months ago >> (already spayed) and was so thin I thought she was an elderly cat >> with not much time left so I took her home to give her some comfort >> in her final days. When I took her to the vet it turned out that she >> isn't that old (vet things 4-5) but she's Leuk+. I decided to keep >> her in my room where I have another Leuk+ guy. I'm building a little >> catio for them outside one of the bedroom windows so they can enjoy >> the outside. >> Flaqui's numbers in January 2018 were... >> RBC - 4.15 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW >> HCT - 20.2% (30.0-45.0) LOW >> HGB 6.8 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW >> MCV 48.7 fL (41.0-58.0) >> MCH - 16.5 pg (12.0-20.0) >> MCHC - 33.8 g/dL (29.0-37.5) >> RDW - 20.5% (17.3-22.0) >> %RETIC - 1.3% >> RETIC - 53.2 K/uL (3.0-50.0) HIGH >> WBC - 15.30 K/uL (5.50-19.50) >> EOS - 1.8 K/uL (0.10-0.79) HIGH >> PLT - 663 K/uL (175-600) >> Everything else was normal >> I started her on Liqui-Tinic which is a supplement containing iron >> and B-12 among other things. Also giving her Vetri-DMG. She >> initially had very bad diarrhea but I managed to clear this with >> Metronidazole. She's also been dewormed and got Revolution. >> Despite eating and showing an interest in food, she has been losing >> weight (down to 5 lbs) so last week I had bloodwork done again. Here >> are the results... >> RBC - 3.79 M/ul (5.00-10.00) LOW >> HCT - 14.8% (30.0-45.0) LOW >> HGB 8.1 g/dl (9.0-15.1) LOW >> MCV 39.2 fL (41.0-58.0) LOW >> MCH - 21.4 pg (12.0-20.0) HIGH >> MCHC - --- g/dL (29.0-37.5) >> RDW - 21.7% (17.3-22.0) >> %RETIC - 1.1% >> RETIC - 40.7 K/uL (3.0-50.0) >> WBC - 22.73. K/uL (5.50-19.50) HIGH >> NEU - 18.48 K/uL (2.50-12.50) HIGH >> PLT 698 K/uL (175-600) HIGH >> Everything else was normal >> My vet told me to start her on Clavamox since the white blood cell >> count was high which is indicative on an infection somewhere. I was >> really alarmed by the HCT number because I had a cat with chronic >> renal failure and anemia some years back and I know that once the HCT >> numbers get below 20% it can be very dangerous. With that cat, >> Grayson, I used Aranesp very successfully to treat his anemia. He >> eventually succumbed to the kidney failure but the Aranesp kept his >> anemia at bay. >> I've been reading that blood transfusions are one of the things to >> do with Leuk+ cats once the HCT numbers get low but blood >> transfusions in my area (South FL) are in the $1000 range and I >> manage 6 colonies and have other cats at home with medical needs >> including one that needs a full mouth extraction for stomatitis and I >> just can't spend that type of money on Flaqui. >> Do you guys think that Aranesp is something that would work on her? >> She does not have kidney problems. However, based on the >> reticulocyte levels, she does seem to have non-regenerative anaemia. >> I read this document at Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic >> Kidney Disease that explains that the reticulocyte level needs to be >> adjusted based on PCV... >> In particular, since reticulocytes are commonly expressed in >> percentage terms, they need to be adjusted to allow for the degree of >> anaemia, i.e. 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 20% is twice as >> many as 1% reticulocytes in a cat with a PCV of 10%. >> Let's assume your cat's PCV is 18% and the measured reticulocyte >> count is 0.75%. You multiply the PCV by the measured count, then >> divide the result by the normal PCV level (35% for many >> laboratories). In this instance, you would get an adjusted result of >> 0.39%, which indicates non-regeneration. >> In contrast, if your cat's PCV was 13% and the measured reticulocyte >> count was 0.75%, your adjusted result would be 0.28. This also >> indicates non-regeneration, but it is more severe (i.e. the lower the >> corrected value, the lower the regenerative response). >> Flaqui's adjusted reticulocyte level is 14.8HCT X 1.1 RET = 16.28/35 >> = .46 which indicates non-regeneration. >> Any help would be appreciated. Flaqui has been doing better the >> last couple of days. I think the Clavamox helped - but I really wish >> I could improve those HCT numbers. >> Maribel & Flaqui. >> "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are >> treated." >> -Mohandas Ghandi >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 46, Issue 7 > *************************************** > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pilotom at bellsouth.net Wed May 16 17:38:05 2018 From: pilotom at bellsouth.net (Maribel Piloto) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 22:38:05 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol, Doxy and Prednisolone In-Reply-To: References: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> Message-ID: <836904179.2112939.1526510285406@mail.yahoo.com> Ok guys - thanks to ALL the help from everyone - I got the Winstrol, Doxy and Prednisolone (all in liquid from Diamondback Drugs) and I'm ready to start my Flaqui on this to treat her anemia.? One more question - I give Flagui Liqui-Tinic which is an iron/B-12 supplement 1ml twice a day.? Now I have to incorporate these other three medicines into her regiment.? So should I give all these liquids to her at the same time?? Should I wait for?an hour or more in between liquids.? It seems like a lot of liquids and different medicines to give at the same time and I suspect it would REALLY stress her out (she isn't the easiest of cats to medicate).? What do you guys do with your cats? Thanks.Maribel & Flaqui?"The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Wed May 16 17:44:00 2018 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 22:44:00 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol, Doxy and Prednisolone In-Reply-To: <836904179.2112939.1526510285406@mail.yahoo.com> References: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> <836904179.2112939.1526510285406@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Maribel, I think that is really an issue of comfort for you and for your cat. I personally prefer to do it all at once, because I prefer not to have to constantly be grabbing my cat, all day long, and giving her/him more meds. I therefore prefer to prolong the single session rather than break it into multiple sessions. I suggest that you might consider holding off on the iron/B12 supplement for now. Most supplements, vitamins, etc., don?t need to be given daily anyway. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Maribel Piloto Sent: May-16-18 6:38 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol, Doxy and Prednisolone Ok guys - thanks to ALL the help from everyone - I got the Winstrol, Doxy and Prednisolone (all in liquid from Diamondback Drugs) and I'm ready to start my Flaqui on this to treat her anemia. One more question - I give Flagui Liqui-Tinic which is an iron/B-12 supplement 1ml twice a day. Now I have to incorporate these other three medicines into her regiment. So should I give all these liquids to her at the same time? Should I wait for an hour or more in between liquids. It seems like a lot of liquids and different medicines to give at the same time and I suspect it would REALLY stress her out (she isn't the easiest of cats to medicate). What do you guys do with your cats? Thanks. Maribel & Flaqui "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From swacht1946 at comcast.net Wed May 16 18:40:39 2018 From: swacht1946 at comcast.net (Sandy) Date: Wed, 16 May 2018 19:40:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol, Doxy and Prednisolone In-Reply-To: References: <72810c8e.42b76.1635abcc522.Webtop.40@optonline.net> <836904179.2112939.1526510285406@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1377769197.813391.1526514039723@connect.xfinity.com> WOW - quick action from Diamondback Drugs! Best of luck - don't give up!! Sandy W > On May 16, 2018 at 6:44 PM Amani Oakley wrote: > > > Maribel, I think that is really an issue of comfort for you and for your cat. I personally prefer to do it all at once, because I prefer not to have to constantly be grabbing my cat, all day long, and giving her/him more meds. I therefore prefer to prolong the single session rather than break it into multiple sessions. I suggest that you might consider holding off on the iron/B12 supplement for now. Most supplements, vitamins, etc., don?t need to be given daily anyway. > > > > Amani > > > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Maribel Piloto > Sent: May-16-18 6:38 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol, Doxy and Prednisolone > > > > Ok guys - thanks to ALL the help from everyone - I got the Winstrol, Doxy and Prednisolone (all in liquid from Diamondback Drugs) and I'm ready to start my Flaqui on this to treat her anemia. One more question - I give Flagui Liqui-Tinic which is an iron/B-12 supplement 1ml twice a day. Now I have to incorporate these other three medicines into her regiment. So should I give all these liquids to her at the same time? Should I wait for an hour or more in between liquids. It seems like a lot of liquids and different medicines to give at the same time and I suspect it would REALLY stress her out (she isn't the easiest of cats to medicate). What do you guys do with your cats? > > > > Thanks. > > Maribel & Flaqui > > > > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bchapel at optonline.net Thu May 17 09:31:41 2018 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 17 May 2018 10:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Meds all at once..... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2afe0db2.5766a.1636e837d41.Webtop.34@optonline.net> Maribel.... At those time that I have had to give multiple meds I preferred ( both for my own comfort and my relationship with my Kitties) to do it all at once ( usually 2-3 times a day).... I found that when I tried spacing meds out throughout the day my cats regarded me as this evil being that was only going to cause them discomfort ( " Hey every time he reaches for me it's only to shove something down my throat!!!? what's up with THAT" ) Yeah...maybe it was me imagining it but....massed meds worked better.??? BTW.... in those instances when one or two of the meds were injections I did those at different times of the day....?? I would not have had that freedom, however, had I not been retired at the time......?? Sometimes the exigencies of life dictate what one MUST do From pilotom at bellsouth.net Thu May 17 11:27:53 2018 From: pilotom at bellsouth.net (Maribel Piloto) Date: Thu, 17 May 2018 16:27:53 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Felvtalk] Meds all at once..... In-Reply-To: <2afe0db2.5766a.1636e837d41.Webtop.34@optonline.net> References: <2afe0db2.5766a.1636e837d41.Webtop.34@optonline.net> Message-ID: <708932394.2403437.1526574473836@mail.yahoo.com> Yes?- this is one of my?fears.?? Over the week I work and feed colonies and so I only see Flaqui in the morning and late at night.? She sleeps with me but it would seem as if whenever I was awake, I would be plunging medicines down her throat.? I was concerned about the interaction of the medicines but if you guys don't think that's a?problem, I will definitely do everything at once. Maribel ?"The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -Mohandas Ghandi From: ROBERT CHAPEL To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Meds all at once..... Maribel.... At those time that I have had to give multiple meds I preferred ( both for my own comfort and my relationship with my Kitties) to do it all at once ( usually 2-3 times a day).... I found that when I tried spacing meds out throughout the day my cats regarded me as this evil being that was only going to cause them discomfort ( " Hey every time he reaches for me it's only to shove something down my throat!!!? what's up with THAT" ) Yeah...maybe it was me imagining it but....massed meds worked better.??? BTW.... in those instances when one or two of the meds were injections I did those at different times of the day....?? I would not have had that freedom, however, had I not been retired at the time......?? Sometimes the exigencies of life dictate what one MUST do _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From swacht1946 at comcast.net Thu May 17 11:41:38 2018 From: swacht1946 at comcast.net (Sandy) Date: Thu, 17 May 2018 12:41:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Meds all at once..... In-Reply-To: <708932394.2403437.1526574473836@mail.yahoo.com> References: <2afe0db2.5766a.1636e837d41.Webtop.34@optonline.net> <708932394.2403437.1526574473836@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1051072713.738417.1526575299268@connect.xfinity.com> Maribel, I'd follow up with a little liquid Sandy W > On May 17, 2018 at 12:27 PM Maribel Piloto wrote: > > > > Yes - this is one of my fears. Over the week I work and feed colonies and so I only see Flaqui in the morning and late at night. She sleeps with me but it would seem as if whenever I was awake, I would be plunging medicines down her throat. I was concerned about the interaction of the medicines but if you guys don't think that's a problem, I will definitely do everything at once. > > Maribel > > > "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated." > -Mohandas Ghandi > > > > --------------------------------------------- > From: ROBERT CHAPEL > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2018 10:31 AM > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Meds all at once..... > > > > > Maribel.... > At those time that I have had to give multiple meds I preferred ( both > for my own comfort and my relationship with my Kitties) to do it all at > once ( usually 2-3 times a day).... I found that when I tried spacing > meds out throughout the day my cats regarded me as this evil being that > was only going to cause them discomfort ( " Hey every time he reaches > for me it's only to shove something down my throat!!! what's up with > THAT" ) > Yeah...maybe it was me imagining it but....massed meds worked better. > BTW.... in those instances when one or two of the meds were injections I > did those at different times of the day.... I would not have had that > freedom, however, had I not been retired at the time...... Sometimes > the exigencies of life dictate what one MUST do > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org mailto:Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From saveoliver at yahoo.com Thu May 31 13:27:28 2018 From: saveoliver at yahoo.com (Oliver Mccann) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 18:27:28 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Felvtalk] FeLV induced non-regenerative anemia treatment question References: <1519390949.775039.1527791248939.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1519390949.775039.1527791248939@mail.yahoo.com> Hi everyone, My cat Oliver is 3.5 and has been diagnosed with FeLV and appears to have non regenerative anemia. So far he has been through 5 blood transfusions over the last month, the first 3 in the hospital in the first 6 days, and now he seems to be about a week to nine days in between. We couldn't get him stable enough to do a bone marrow aspiration before we started him on steroids so we don't have the full picture, but I want to do whatever I can to help.? I have perused the archives and I think I have come up with a treatment plan but I want to run it by everyone to see if I am doing it right.? So far I have seen the best treatment option to be? Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a dayThis is the most common treatment I see you guys recommend. Right now he is only on Prednisolone.? I have read about Acemannan and Sodium Ascorbate treatments that may work but I haven't seen any info on that in the archives. Also what so you guys think about LTCI? Thanks is advance. We have insurance on the little guy so $$ is not much of a problem. We are willing to try anything. Cheers, -Ben Pavlichek -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Thu May 31 13:36:41 2018 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 18:36:41 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] FeLV induced non-regenerative anemia treatment question In-Reply-To: <1519390949.775039.1527791248939@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1519390949.775039.1527791248939.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <1519390949.775039.1527791248939@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I think you?re low on the doxycycline. If you?re going to give it twice a day, stick to ? twice a day. Also, if Oliver has trouble keeping food down (as my Zander did when I put this ?protocol? together) I added metoclopramide ? tablet a little before I would feed him. Amani From: Felvtalk On Behalf Of Oliver Mccann Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2018 2:27 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] FeLV induced non-regenerative anemia treatment question Hi everyone, My cat Oliver is 3.5 and has been diagnosed with FeLV and appears to have non regenerative anemia. So far he has been through 5 blood transfusions over the last month, the first 3 in the hospital in the first 6 days, and now he seems to be about a week to nine days in between. We couldn't get him stable enough to do a bone marrow aspiration before we started him on steroids so we don't have the full picture, but I want to do whatever I can to help. I have perused the archives and I think I have come up with a treatment plan but I want to run it by everyone to see if I am doing it right. So far I have seen the best treatment option to be Winstrol ? 1 mg twice a day Doxycycline ? 1/5 to ? tablet (100 mg) twice a day Prednisolone ? ? 5 mg tablet, twice a day This is the most common treatment I see you guys recommend. Right now he is only on Prednisolone. I have read about Acemannan and Sodium Ascorbate treatments that may work but I haven't seen any info on that in the archives. Also what so you guys think about LTCI? Thanks is advance. We have insurance on the little guy so $$ is not much of a problem. We are willing to try anything. Cheers, -Ben Pavlichek -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: