From marlmel at hotmail.com Wed Nov 1 03:28:40 2017 From: marlmel at hotmail.com (marlene melpignano) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 08:28:40 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear All, Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... Thanks for your help Marl?ne Inviato da iPhone From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Wed Nov 1 08:38:22 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 13:38:22 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Marlene The suggestion of Winstrol/Doxy/Prednisone has been used repeatedly on cats with leukemia and lymphoma. Also, Winstrol is very helpful when a cat is not eating. Unfortunately, though there are other steroids, I am not certain you will get the same result if you use another steroid in place of the Winstrol. DO NOT USE another antibiotic. Doxycycline interferes with the virus replication and is added on to assist in retarding the reproduction of the virus, to enable the Winstrol and prednisone to have an effect. It is not for a secondary infection. I find it bizarre that, over and over again, vets will dither while a cat is dying. Put the cat on the meds, for goodness sake, and see the response and if there isn?t an appreciable response after a reasonable period of time, look for another option. But don?t have a debate while the cat is declining. What's the worst that could happen? It doesn?t work? What other options are they giving you??? I find it odd that the vets say Winstrol is illegal in Europe. If you go on line, you will see that it can be ordered from places like Germany. If necessary, get your vets to put him on the other steroid, though I really doubt it will assist - Winstrol uniquely causes the turning on of blood cell production in the bone marrow - I don?t think there is another steroid that does this. Then go ahead and order the Winstrol online from Germany or wherever else it can be sourced. But don't wait. The longer you wait, the worse the condition of your cat, thus worsening the chances of anything working. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of marlene melpignano Sent: November-01-17 4:29 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Dear All, Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... Thanks for your help Marl?ne Inviato da iPhone _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From dlgegg at windstream.net Wed Nov 1 13:47:19 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 13:47:19 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Dear All, > Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > > Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > > About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > > Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > > Thanks for your help > Marl?ne > > > Inviato da iPhone _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From dlgegg at windstream.net Wed Nov 1 14:24:50 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 14:24:50 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20171101152450.OYSA9.18972.root@pamxwww01-z01> ---- Amani Oakley wrote: > Marlene > > The suggestion of Winstrol/Doxy/Prednisone has been used repeatedly on cats with leukemia and lymphoma. Also, Winstrol is very helpful when a cat is not eating. Unfortunately, though there are other steroids, I am not certain you will get the same result if you use another steroid in place of the Winstrol. DO NOT USE another antibiotic. Doxycycline interferes with the virus replication and is added on to assist in retarding the reproduction of the virus, to enable the Winstrol and prednisone to have an effect. It is not for a secondary infection. > > I find it bizarre that, over and over again, vets will dither while a cat is dying. Put the cat on the meds, for goodness sake, and see the response and if there isn?t an appreciable response after a reasonable period of time, look for another option. But don?t have a debate while the cat is declining. What's the worst that could happen? It doesn?t work? What other options are they giving you??? COULD IT BE THAT VETS ARE WORRIED ABOUT LAWSUITS IF ANYTHING GOES WRONG? > > I find it odd that the vets say Winstrol is illegal in Europe. If you go on line, you will see that it can be ordered from places like Germany. > > If necessary, get your vets to put him on the other steroid, though I really doubt it will assist - Winstrol uniquely causes the turning on of blood cell production in the bone marrow - I don?t think there is another steroid that does this. Then go ahead and order the Winstrol online from Germany or wherever else it can be sourced. But don't wait. The longer you wait, the worse the condition of your cat, thus worsening the chances of anything working. > > Amani > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of marlene melpignano > Sent: November-01-17 4:29 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Dear All, > Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > > Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > > About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > > Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > > Thanks for your help > Marl?ne > > > Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From ardyr at centurytel.net Wed Nov 1 23:28:40 2017 From: ardyr at centurytel.net (Ardy Robertson) Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 23:28:40 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> References: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> Message-ID: <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! Ardy -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Dear All, > Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > > Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > > About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > > Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > > Thanks for your help > Marl?ne > > > Inviato da iPhone _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From marlmel at hotmail.com Thu Nov 2 05:03:38 2017 From: marlmel at hotmail.com (marlene melpignano) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 10:03:38 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> References: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Dear all, Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. Thanks all for your support. Best M&M Inviato da iPhone > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... >> >> Thanks for your help >> Marl?ne >> >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From dlgegg at windstream.net Thu Nov 2 08:21:32 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 8:21:32 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20171102092132.4F6D1.2039.root@pamxwww01-z01> Prayers for you and your baby. ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? > I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > > > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > > > Ardy > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > >> Dear All, > >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > >> > >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > >> > >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > >> > >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > >> > >> Thanks for your help > >> Marl?ne > >> > >> > >> Inviato da iPhone > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Thu Nov 2 09:09:34 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 14:09:34 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: References: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Pills. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of marlene melpignano Sent: November-02-17 6:04 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Dear all, Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. Thanks all for your support. Best M&M Inviato da iPhone > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... >> >> Thanks for your help >> Marl?ne >> >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From kresch831 at mchsi.com Thu Nov 2 09:18:48 2017 From: kresch831 at mchsi.com (kresch831 at mchsi.com) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 10:18:48 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: References: <346607319.431445473.1509632305587.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <727209949.431446468.1509632328992.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Good Morningh all-- I've been following the posts to Marlene and others regarding Winstrol/Stargate. I began following when my feral-turned-wonderful-domestic Tuxedo, Zorro, became ill with FeLV. We tried the Prednisolone route and he perked up for a week or so but then just slept more and more as his red count bottomed out. I laid next to him as he died and shared that with all of you at that time. What I'm writing about now is what we must do for future cats that may contract FeLV. I have printed the pertinent information that began with Amani and then others regarding Winstrol and Stargate minus any links and email addresses. I am taking this info to my Vet and telling her to start her research immediately. I will also tell her she could be the first Vet in our area to truly treat our kitties with a drug that works. If we all present the information we've been sharing we will begin a ground-swell of interest and hope. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: dlgegg at windstream.net To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Thu, 02 Nov 2017 09:21:32 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Prayers for you and your baby. ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? > I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > > > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > > > Ardy > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > >> Dear All, > >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > >> > >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > >> > >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > >> > >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > >> > >> Thanks for your help > >> Marl?ne > >> > >> > >> Inviato da iPhone > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Thu Nov 2 09:21:43 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 14:21:43 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: References: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Marlene, I should really say that I have never used the injectable form but it is injected intramuscularly and doesn?t last very long, and will be far less convenient to give than the pills. As I mentioned in a previous response, the effect on the liver appears to be transitory and fades after the Winstrol is discontinued. You might consider an initial intramuscular injection by your vet, to give a quick boost to baseline, and then continuing with daily pills. I am also THRILLED to hear that Winstrol is used regularly in Itally for FeLV. Finally, SOMEWHERE that is using a medication that actually shows some promise against this hideous virus, and doesn?t appear to be swayed by the highly irrelevant athletic doping scandals! Good luck Marlene and keep us posted. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of marlene melpignano Sent: November-02-17 6:04 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Dear all, Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. Thanks all for your support. Best M&M Inviato da iPhone > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... >> >> Thanks for your help >> Marl?ne >> >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Thu Nov 2 10:04:09 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 15:04:09 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: <727209949.431446468.1509632328992.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> References: <346607319.431445473.1509632305587.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> <727209949.431446468.1509632328992.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: Hi Ken I couldn?t agree with you more, but I fear that the scientific/medical evidence is thin because of the really stupid study done a decade ago, which gave three cats massive doses of Winstrol (same levels as given to sled dogs) and reported the resulting elevation of liver enzymes. And then, of course, there is the unhelpful connection to the athletic doping scandals. Studies looking into the effects of Winstrol are therefore few and far between (though I have found a few). Moreover, a physician friend of mine explained to me that once a drug is off-patent (as Winstrol is) then the drug companies can make very little money from it, and so they will not spend money to set up clinical trials, and will instead push other related drugs that are still covered by a patent, so they make more money on the sale of those other drugs. The problem is that, as far as I can determine to date, though there are lots of anabolic steroids, Winstrol is the only one that seems to have this effect on bone marrow to cause it to grow, create new cells, regenerate, etc, which in turn causes the production of red cells, white cells and platelets from the activated bone marrow. In addition, Winstrol is considered to have very mild side effects in comparison to other anabolic steroids. Winstrol is also found to be very quickly effective. Most of those athletes who will speak about steroid use, confirm that Winstrol is one of the most effective and safest of the drugs (and remember that athletes who are using steroids use them at hundreds if not thousands of times the recommended doses, and they "stack" them will all sorts of other steroids). I also found, with my own vets, that even with solid proof in front of their own eyes (with cats condemned to death, showing an amazing recovery), they will often look for other explanations other than that it was the Winstrol. As I mentioned with my little Zander, after being told by every vet I spoke with that there was nothing I could do and Zander was going to die (and best to put him down immediately), and being able to show serial blood results weekly which showed a clear improvement from critical haematology values to normal results, at the end of it all, I start hearing things like, "well maybe it was never FeLV in the first place". I agree that the way to start turning this around, for all of us who have had good results or who may have a cat in the unenviable situation of having little or no other options, is to speak with our vets about Winstrol. As I have mentioned in previous posts, I have now used Winstrol, usually in combination with at least the prednisone (with the doxycycline being added on in circumstances involving something likely infectious), for a range of cat problems and have had excellent results every time but once. One case was a 16 year old cat with a nasal sarcoma (kept the sarcoma from causing severe facial swelling, and kept my cat eating for another two years); one case was a cat who came from a feral colony which I later found out had had FIV rampaging through it and killing all the cats (and she came to me EXTREMELY ill with a sky-high fever, tympanic abdomen and fluid around her lungs - she survived when I thought there was no hope at all, and she's still with me now); I have used it to avoid knee surgery for Zander when he pulled his cruciate ligament; and am I currently using it now to treat a spinal lesion in Pippin - a three-year old who gets flair-ups of neurological problems which I tracked to a spinal lesion, and when the lesion causes swelling, etc., the symptoms reappear. The combination of prednisone and Winstrol appears to be the only thing that reverses the effects of the lesion. I think the Winstrol is seriously underutilized and cats respond very well to it, in a number of circumstances. Obviously, it is not a cure-all, and we've heard from other folks who've tried it and gotten no appreciable results, so I am not suggesting it is a panacea by any means. Further, I understand that FeLV is now thought to be caused by at least four or five different types or strains of virus, and I believe that this is the reason that some people get amazing results and some people see nothing. Hopefully, Marlene will get a good response, and it is very heartening to hear that in Italy, the drug is commonly used to treat FeLV cats. It was commonly used in North America as well, in the '80's and '90's, until the stupid doping scandals (especially Ben Johnson's Olympic gold medal being stripped) shone an ugly spotlight on it. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-02-17 10:19 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Good Morningh all-- I've been following the posts to Marlene and others regarding Winstrol/Stargate. I began following when my feral-turned-wonderful-domestic Tuxedo, Zorro, became ill with FeLV. We tried the Prednisolone route and he perked up for a week or so but then just slept more and more as his red count bottomed out. I laid next to him as he died and shared that with all of you at that time. What I'm writing about now is what we must do for future cats that may contract FeLV. I have printed the pertinent information that began with Amani and then others regarding Winstrol and Stargate minus any links and email addresses. I am taking this info to my Vet and telling her to start her research immediately. I will also tell her she could be the first Vet in our area to truly treat our kitties with a drug that works. If we all present the information we've been sharing we will begin a ground-swell of interest and hope. Ken ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? > I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > > > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > > > Ardy > > > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > >> Dear All, > >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > >> > >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > >> > >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > >> > >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > >> > >> Thanks for your help > >> Marl?ne From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 2 15:30:40 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 16:30:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] erasing redundant posts... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6c36c275.10f30a.15f7e6db832.Webtop.50@optonline.net> PLEASE folks... A lot of us could be missing important information while leafing through 20 previously posted messages and not noticing the ONE that is new...???? It is frustrating sometimes that I will go to the trouble of deleting everything and then see it reappear anyway.... I don't get it... BUT... still worth the effort for the time that it DOES work... I'll check and HOPE that this on doesn't include everything that went before?? : ) Bob in Warwick ny > From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 2 15:30:40 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 16:30:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] erasing redundant posts... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6c36c275.10f30a.15f7e6db832.Webtop.50@optonline.net> PLEASE folks... A lot of us could be missing important information while leafing through 20 previously posted messages and not noticing the ONE that is new...???? It is frustrating sometimes that I will go to the trouble of deleting everything and then see it reappear anyway.... I don't get it... BUT... still worth the effort for the time that it DOES work... I'll check and HOPE that this on doesn't include everything that went before?? : ) Bob in Warwick ny > From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 2 15:40:38 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 16:40:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Stargate? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <65d654ac.10f344.15f7e76d993.Webtop.50@optonline.net> An odd name for a drug... but... terrific if it really is Stanazalol and you can get hold of it... Your Kitty is lucky to have an owner so commited to his survival... I am hoping hard that all your kind effort pays off... he AND you deserve it..... I don't know that it makes a difference which mode of administration is used... though, generally, with drugs some of the dose is lost while traveling through the digestive system and first pass through the liver ( though that will happen i)...? so I'd be "inclined" more toward injection if it's SubQ ( they hardly feel it) IM can be a bit more painful and I'd want to know for certain that there are clear advantages to this before I subjected a kitty to this... I'm so hoping fate and luck are with you and your kitty... On Thu, Nov 02, 2017 at 10:09 AM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: > Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to > felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (dlgegg at windstream.net) > 2. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (Ardy Robertson) > 3. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (marlene melpignano) > 4. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (dlgegg at windstream.net) > 5. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (Amani Oakley) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 14:24:50 -0500 > From: To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <20171101152450.OYSA9.18972.root at pamxwww01-z01> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > > ---- Amani Oakley wrote: >> Marlene >> >> The suggestion of Winstrol/Doxy/Prednisone has been used repeatedly >> on cats with leukemia and lymphoma. Also, Winstrol is very helpful >> when a cat is not eating. Unfortunately, though there are other >> steroids, I am not certain you will get the same result if you use >> another steroid in place of the Winstrol. DO NOT USE another >> antibiotic. Doxycycline interferes with the virus replication and is >> added on to assist in retarding the reproduction of the virus, to >> enable the Winstrol and prednisone to have an effect. It is not for a >> secondary infection. >> I find it bizarre that, over and over again, vets will dither while a >> cat is dying. Put the cat on the meds, for goodness sake, and see the >> response and if there isn?t an appreciable response after a >> reasonable period of time, look for another option. But don?t have a >> debate while the cat is declining. What's the worst that could >> happen? It doesn?t work? What other options are they giving you??? > > COULD IT BE THAT VETS ARE WORRIED ABOUT LAWSUITS IF ANYTHING GOES > WRONG? >> >> I find it odd that the vets say Winstrol is illegal in Europe. If you >> go on line, you will see that it can be ordered from places like >> Germany. >> If necessary, get your vets to put him on the other steroid, though I >> really doubt it will assist - Winstrol uniquely causes the turning on >> of blood cell production in the bone marrow - I don?t think there is >> another steroid that does this. Then go ahead and order the Winstrol >> online from Germany or wherever else it can be sourced. But don't >> wait. The longer you wait, the worse the condition of your cat, thus >> worsening the chances of anything working. >> >> Amani >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of marlene melpignano >> Sent: November-01-17 4:29 AM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma >> or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have >> a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a >> university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide >> whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were >> just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise >> they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >> today he is not eating ... >> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 23:28:40 -0500 > From: "Ardy Robertson" To: Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or > Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, > based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an > appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, > every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the > canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very > calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to > clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want > to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my > mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I > believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When > he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his > kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not > legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the > misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without > the one thing that can help them. I > t is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had > no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma >> or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have >> a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a >> university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide >> whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were >> just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise >> they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >> today he is not eating ... >> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 10:03:38 +0000 > From: marlene melpignano To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: > Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called > stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I > will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in > Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less > stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the > injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this > afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > >> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >> >> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an >> appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to >> clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want >> to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my >> mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I >> believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When >> he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his >> kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is >> not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the >> misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without >> the one thing that can help them. > It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >> >> Ardy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of dlgegg at windstream.net >> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >> >> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>> Dear All, >>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>> >>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >>> >>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >>> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or >>> were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; >>> otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>> >>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >>> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >>> today he is not eating ... >>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>> >>> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 8:21:32 -0500 > From: To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <20171102092132.4F6D1.2039.root at pamxwww01-z01> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Prayers for you and your baby. > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear all, >> Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called >> stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I >> will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in >> Italy for felv cats. >> What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less >> stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the >> injectable one . >> I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this >> afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. >> >> Thanks all for your support. >> Best >> M&M >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> >>> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >>> >>> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >>> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him >>> an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >>> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >>> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >>> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had >>> to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not >>> want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made >>> up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in >>> him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite >>> stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice >>> (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful >>> that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against >>> it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties >>> have to suffer without the one thing that can help the > m. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >>> >>> Ardy >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On >>> Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >>> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >>> immunomodulator - help >>> >>> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >>> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >>> >>> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>>> Dear All, >>>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>>> >>>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the >>>> cat? >>>> >>>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know >>>> whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used >>>> it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going >>>> on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>>> >>>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to >>>> be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As >>>> of today he is not eating ... >>>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>>> >>>> Inviato da iPhone >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 14:09:34 +0000 > From: Amani Oakley To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: Re: > [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Pills. > Amani > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > Of marlene melpignano > Sent: November-02-17 6:04 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called > stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I > will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in > Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less > stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the > injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this > afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > >> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >> >> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an >> appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to >> clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want >> to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my >> mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I >> believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When >> he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his >> kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is >> not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the >> misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without >> the one thing that can help them. > It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >> >> Ardy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of dlgegg at windstream.net >> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >> >> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>> Dear All, >>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>> >>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >>> >>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >>> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or >>> were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; >>> otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>> >>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >>> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >>> today he is not eating ... >>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>> >>> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 2 > *************************************** > From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 2 15:40:38 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 16:40:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Stargate? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <65d654ac.10f344.15f7e76d993.Webtop.50@optonline.net> An odd name for a drug... but... terrific if it really is Stanazalol and you can get hold of it... Your Kitty is lucky to have an owner so commited to his survival... I am hoping hard that all your kind effort pays off... he AND you deserve it..... I don't know that it makes a difference which mode of administration is used... though, generally, with drugs some of the dose is lost while traveling through the digestive system and first pass through the liver ( though that will happen i)...? so I'd be "inclined" more toward injection if it's SubQ ( they hardly feel it) IM can be a bit more painful and I'd want to know for certain that there are clear advantages to this before I subjected a kitty to this... I'm so hoping fate and luck are with you and your kitty... On Thu, Nov 02, 2017 at 10:09 AM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: > Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to > felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (dlgegg at windstream.net) > 2. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (Ardy Robertson) > 3. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (marlene melpignano) > 4. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (dlgegg at windstream.net) > 5. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (Amani Oakley) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 14:24:50 -0500 > From: To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <20171101152450.OYSA9.18972.root at pamxwww01-z01> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > > ---- Amani Oakley wrote: >> Marlene >> >> The suggestion of Winstrol/Doxy/Prednisone has been used repeatedly >> on cats with leukemia and lymphoma. Also, Winstrol is very helpful >> when a cat is not eating. Unfortunately, though there are other >> steroids, I am not certain you will get the same result if you use >> another steroid in place of the Winstrol. DO NOT USE another >> antibiotic. Doxycycline interferes with the virus replication and is >> added on to assist in retarding the reproduction of the virus, to >> enable the Winstrol and prednisone to have an effect. It is not for a >> secondary infection. >> I find it bizarre that, over and over again, vets will dither while a >> cat is dying. Put the cat on the meds, for goodness sake, and see the >> response and if there isn?t an appreciable response after a >> reasonable period of time, look for another option. But don?t have a >> debate while the cat is declining. What's the worst that could >> happen? It doesn?t work? What other options are they giving you??? > > COULD IT BE THAT VETS ARE WORRIED ABOUT LAWSUITS IF ANYTHING GOES > WRONG? >> >> I find it odd that the vets say Winstrol is illegal in Europe. If you >> go on line, you will see that it can be ordered from places like >> Germany. >> If necessary, get your vets to put him on the other steroid, though I >> really doubt it will assist - Winstrol uniquely causes the turning on >> of blood cell production in the bone marrow - I don?t think there is >> another steroid that does this. Then go ahead and order the Winstrol >> online from Germany or wherever else it can be sourced. But don't >> wait. The longer you wait, the worse the condition of your cat, thus >> worsening the chances of anything working. >> >> Amani >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of marlene melpignano >> Sent: November-01-17 4:29 AM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma >> or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have >> a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a >> university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide >> whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were >> just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise >> they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >> today he is not eating ... >> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 23:28:40 -0500 > From: "Ardy Robertson" To: Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or > Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, > based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an > appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, > every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the > canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very > calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to > clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want > to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my > mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I > believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When > he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his > kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not > legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the > misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without > the one thing that can help them. I > t is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had > no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma >> or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have >> a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a >> university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide >> whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were >> just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise >> they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >> today he is not eating ... >> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 10:03:38 +0000 > From: marlene melpignano To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: > Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called > stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I > will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in > Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less > stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the > injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this > afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > >> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >> >> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an >> appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to >> clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want >> to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my >> mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I >> believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When >> he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his >> kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is >> not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the >> misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without >> the one thing that can help them. > It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >> >> Ardy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of dlgegg at windstream.net >> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >> >> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>> Dear All, >>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>> >>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >>> >>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >>> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or >>> were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; >>> otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>> >>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >>> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >>> today he is not eating ... >>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>> >>> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 8:21:32 -0500 > From: To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <20171102092132.4F6D1.2039.root at pamxwww01-z01> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Prayers for you and your baby. > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear all, >> Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called >> stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I >> will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in >> Italy for felv cats. >> What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less >> stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the >> injectable one . >> I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this >> afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. >> >> Thanks all for your support. >> Best >> M&M >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> >>> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >>> >>> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >>> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him >>> an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >>> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >>> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >>> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had >>> to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not >>> want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made >>> up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in >>> him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite >>> stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice >>> (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful >>> that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against >>> it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties >>> have to suffer without the one thing that can help the > m. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >>> >>> Ardy >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On >>> Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >>> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >>> immunomodulator - help >>> >>> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >>> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >>> >>> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>>> Dear All, >>>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>>> >>>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the >>>> cat? >>>> >>>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know >>>> whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used >>>> it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going >>>> on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>>> >>>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to >>>> be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As >>>> of today he is not eating ... >>>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>>> >>>> Inviato da iPhone >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 14:09:34 +0000 > From: Amani Oakley To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: Re: > [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Pills. > Amani > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > Of marlene melpignano > Sent: November-02-17 6:04 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called > stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I > will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in > Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less > stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the > injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this > afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > >> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >> >> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an >> appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to >> clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want >> to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my >> mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I >> believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When >> he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his >> kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is >> not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the >> misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without >> the one thing that can help them. > It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >> >> Ardy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of dlgegg at windstream.net >> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >> >> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>> Dear All, >>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>> >>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >>> >>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >>> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or >>> were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; >>> otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>> >>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >>> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >>> today he is not eating ... >>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>> >>> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 2 > *************************************** > From swacht1946 at comcast.net Thu Nov 2 16:08:30 2017 From: swacht1946 at comcast.net (Sandy) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 21:08:30 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Felvtalk] Stargate? In-Reply-To: <65d654ac.10f344.15f7e76d993.Webtop.50@optonline.net> References: <65d654ac.10f344.15f7e76d993.Webtop.50@optonline.net> Message-ID: <1698542976.20042677.1509656910392.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net> The Androgen Group-Anabolic Steroids Veterinary & Aquatic Services Department, Drs. Foster & Smith Print Article | Email Article This is from the Drs. Fosters & Smith website - for anyone interested Sandy W These compounds are related to the male hormone testosterone. They are referred to as the anabolic steroids because they cause the formation of new proteins. As we stated before, they are often abused by athletes trying to increase strength and muscle mass. Their use in canine medicine, while infrequent, is related to these and similar properties. Anabolic steroids come in liquid forms for injection and tablets for oral administration. Two of the most commonly used in canine medicine are stanozolol (Winstrol-V) and nandrolone (DecaDurabolin). Animals that have been sick for a long time or who have been through severe, debilitating injuries often have generalized weakness and atrophied muscles. In some, this has progressed to the point where the animals can no longer walk or even stand. Their bodies are just too run down, and without some outside stimulation, they simply may give up the will to live. Anabolic steroids are sometimes useful in these situations. The therapy may take several weeks. The medications can be most helpful if the veterinarian recognizes the condition before too much strength is lost. Anabolic steroids assist the body in regaining its muscle mass by building new proteins, which are the primary constituent of muscle fibers. Additionally, they help strengthen existing muscles. In some of these same cases, anabolic steroids are frequently used to stimulate the debilitated or recovering patient's appetite. To achieve this effect usually requires several days to several weeks of therapy for significant changes. The anabolic steroids are also useful in treating certain types of anemia . Anemia is the term used to describe lower than normal numbers of red blood cells (RBCs). In certain cases where the bone marrow has stopped producing new RBCs, administration of anabolic steroids will stimulate this system and bring the number of these cells back to normal levels. They also are known to stimulate the production of white blood cells and platelets (tiny cells in blood that assist in clotting) to a lesser degree. In these situations, the anabolic steroids are useful only in increasing the numbers of these cells. They do not increase the ability of the cells to function . Kidney failure often brings on anemia because these organs may fail to produce the substance erythropoietin. Its normal function is to monitor the level of RBCs in the body and to stimulate the bone marrow to increase production when RBC numbers are too low. In its absence, anabolic steroids are often useful in reversing the effects of this anemia. They do not cause new erythropoietin to be produced; they only replace its function. In many situations, the anabolic steroids fail to provide the benefits described here. Regardless of which particular product is used, it is often impossible to reverse the condition present. These are not miracle drugs that can save every debilitated or severely ill patient, but in some they can help. As stated, these medications are closely related to testosterone and many of the problems associated with their usage are brought on by the normal actions of the male hormones. They can cause cessation of heat cycles and imitation mounting behavior in females. In males, they have been found to increase the incidence of prostate disease and certain hernias and tumors that are caused by normal testosterone levels in older male dogs. Normal sperm production is often disrupted, with few new cells being formed. None of these problems are considered significant in these cases, as many of the patients are already in a life or death situation. Anabolic steroids also cause water retention and this can cause additional complications in kidney or heart failure patients. These products also increase the absorption of calcium by the intestinal tract and cause the kidneys to retain calcium during normal urine production. Both of these actions lead to excessively high calcium levels in the blood which can be disastrous to normal heart function. This can be quickly fatal in those with already failing hearts. ----- Original Message ----- From: "ROBERT CHAPEL" To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Cc: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 4:40:38 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Stargate? An odd name for a drug... but... terrific if it really is Stanazalol and you can get hold of it... Your Kitty is lucky to have an owner so commited to his survival... I am hoping hard that all your kind effort pays off... he AND you deserve it..... I don't know that it makes a difference which mode of administration is used... though, generally, with drugs some of the dose is lost while traveling through the digestive system and first pass through the liver ( though that will happen i)... so I'd be "inclined" more toward injection if it's SubQ ( they hardly feel it) IM can be a bit more painful and I'd want to know for certain that there are clear advantages to this before I subjected a kitty to this... I'm so hoping fate and luck are with you and your kitty... On Thu, Nov 02, 2017 at 10:09 AM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: > Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to > felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (dlgegg at windstream.net) > 2. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (Ardy Robertson) > 3. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (marlene melpignano) > 4. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (dlgegg at windstream.net) > 5. Re: Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > (Amani Oakley) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 14:24:50 -0500 > From: To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <20171101152450.OYSA9.18972.root at pamxwww01-z01> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > > ---- Amani Oakley wrote: >> Marlene >> >> The suggestion of Winstrol/Doxy/Prednisone has been used repeatedly >> on cats with leukemia and lymphoma. Also, Winstrol is very helpful >> when a cat is not eating. Unfortunately, though there are other >> steroids, I am not certain you will get the same result if you use >> another steroid in place of the Winstrol. DO NOT USE another >> antibiotic. Doxycycline interferes with the virus replication and is >> added on to assist in retarding the reproduction of the virus, to >> enable the Winstrol and prednisone to have an effect. It is not for a >> secondary infection. >> I find it bizarre that, over and over again, vets will dither while a >> cat is dying. Put the cat on the meds, for goodness sake, and see the >> response and if there isn?t an appreciable response after a >> reasonable period of time, look for another option. But don?t have a >> debate while the cat is declining. What's the worst that could >> happen? It doesn?t work? What other options are they giving you??? > > COULD IT BE THAT VETS ARE WORRIED ABOUT LAWSUITS IF ANYTHING GOES > WRONG? >> >> I find it odd that the vets say Winstrol is illegal in Europe. If you >> go on line, you will see that it can be ordered from places like >> Germany. >> If necessary, get your vets to put him on the other steroid, though I >> really doubt it will assist - Winstrol uniquely causes the turning on >> of blood cell production in the bone marrow - I don?t think there is >> another steroid that does this. Then go ahead and order the Winstrol >> online from Germany or wherever else it can be sourced. But don't >> wait. The longer you wait, the worse the condition of your cat, thus >> worsening the chances of anything working. >> >> Amani >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of marlene melpignano >> Sent: November-01-17 4:29 AM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma >> or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have >> a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a >> university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide >> whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were >> just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise >> they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >> today he is not eating ... >> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 23:28:40 -0500 > From: "Ardy Robertson" To: Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or > Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, > based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an > appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, > every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the > canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very > calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to > clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want > to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my > mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I > believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When > he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his > kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not > legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the > misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without > the one thing that can help them. I > t is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had > no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma >> or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have >> a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a >> university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide >> whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were >> just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise >> they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >> today he is not eating ... >> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 10:03:38 +0000 > From: marlene melpignano To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: > Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called > stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I > will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in > Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less > stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the > injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this > afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > >> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >> >> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an >> appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to >> clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want >> to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my >> mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I >> believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When >> he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his >> kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is >> not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the >> misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without >> the one thing that can help them. > It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >> >> Ardy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of dlgegg at windstream.net >> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >> >> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>> Dear All, >>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>> >>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >>> >>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >>> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or >>> were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; >>> otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>> >>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >>> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >>> today he is not eating ... >>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>> >>> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 8:21:32 -0500 > From: To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: <20171102092132.4F6D1.2039.root at pamxwww01-z01> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Prayers for you and your baby. > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear all, >> Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called >> stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I >> will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in >> Italy for felv cats. >> What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less >> stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the >> injectable one . >> I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this >> afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. >> >> Thanks all for your support. >> Best >> M&M >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> >>> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >>> >>> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >>> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him >>> an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >>> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >>> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >>> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had >>> to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not >>> want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made >>> up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in >>> him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite >>> stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice >>> (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful >>> that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against >>> it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties >>> have to suffer without the one thing that can help the > m. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >>> >>> Ardy >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On >>> Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >>> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >>> immunomodulator - help >>> >>> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >>> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >>> >>> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>>> Dear All, >>>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>>> >>>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the >>>> cat? >>>> >>>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know >>>> whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used >>>> it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going >>>> on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>>> >>>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to >>>> be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As >>>> of today he is not eating ... >>>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>>> >>>> Inviato da iPhone >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 14:09:34 +0000 > From: Amani Oakley To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: Re: > [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Pills. > Amani > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > Of marlene melpignano > Sent: November-02-17 6:04 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell > immunomodulator - help > > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called > stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I > will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in > Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less > stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the > injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this > afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > >> Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >> >> Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, >> based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an >> appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg >> tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him >> the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very >> calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to >> clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want >> to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my >> mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I >> believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When >> he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his >> kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is >> not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the >> misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without >> the one thing that can help them. > It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the > Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the > virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >> >> Ardy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of dlgegg at windstream.net >> Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell >> immunomodulator - help >> >> Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had >> no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >> >> ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >>> Dear All, >>> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a >>> lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot >>> even have a conclusive result). My vet in Italy thinks I have to >>> bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in >>> order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >>> >>> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? >>> Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >>> >>> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal >>> in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide >>> not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether >>> your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or >>> were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; >>> otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >>> >>> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be >>> done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of >>> today he is not eating ... >>> Thanks for your help Marl?ne >>> >>> Inviato da iPhone >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 2 > *************************************** > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 2 16:23:55 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 17:23:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4b151dc7.10f423.15f7e9e78ae.Webtop.50@optonline.net> Hi Ken... I well know the experience of lying with a cat dying of Felv until they passed and these posts are reawakening my own sadnesss and frustration at being able to do so little so late with my own two FelV boys.? It is SO difficult for me to grasp the level of opposition to Winstrol on the part of some vets...? they are surely not worried about law suits and they have a dying cat in front of them that they have NO definitive Tx for....why NOT try Winstrol...? It is beyond absurd...? Unless there is some kind of worry at being fingered for prescibing minute doses of an anabolic steroid ( go ahead...take the dose you would give to a cat and see the AMAZING effect is has...? You'll feel nothing....? I can't help but wonder if a lot of vets think if they wipe out the entire population of FeLV cats that they will effectively wipe out the disease( an odd consideration given that there will always BE a "patient Zero"...? it has to start somewhere and likely would again...?? Then again...anemia is only one of the complications of this damnable disease ( though admittedly the most critical...?? They are driving law abiding citizens into illegal activity trying to find alternative sources of a hard to obtain drug in order to save their cats lives.... it's f-in insane!!! There is no end to the irrationality one can encounter when people who are ' supposed ' to be schooled in scientific thinking decide that , that which stands before them....a winstrol treated cat in recovery from anemia must not have had FeLV or there must be an alternative explanation for the recovery....? Everything BUT trying Winstrol on other cats with the disease and SEEING if it works ..run you own N of 5 or 6 mini experiment and see if you get a a positive result.... It's not as though you are using alternative medicine on a cancer patient that MIGHT have survived had they had proven Tx...?? they have NOTHING to offer us that compares with Winstrol in the clutch ( though to date we have only a very few cats who have survived as a result of taking Winstrol and , to my mind, it has not established itself as the de-facto drug for FeLV instigated anemia...but... it is certainly the most hopeful in a field of paltry competitors.....?? We all want to live with hope, and Winstrol gives us this....? So Ken, by all means, spread the word, pester,implore,cajole your vet into trying it....but don't be too terribly surprised when you have to figure out how to dismantle the brick wall you are likely to encounter.. Bob BTW.... Amani..? are you recommending prednisone or prednisolone with the Doxy...?? many vets insist that prednisone is not useful for cats.. > I couldn?t agree with you more, but I fear that the scientific/medical > evidence is thin because of the really stupid study done a decade ago, > which gave three cats massive doses of Winstrol (same levels as given > to sled dogs) and reported the resulting elevation of liver enzymes. > And then, of course, there is the unhelpful connection to the athletic > doping scandals. Studies looking into the effects of Winstrol are > therefore few and far between (though I have found a few). Moreover, a > physician friend of mine explained to me that once a drug is > off-patent (as Winstrol is) then the drug companies can make very > little money from it, and so they will not spend money to set up > clinical trials, and will instead push other related drugs that are > still covered by a patent, so they make more money on the sale of > those other drugs. > > The problem is that, as far as I can determine to date, though there > are lots of anabolic steroids, Winstrol is the only one that seems to > have this effect on bone marrow to cause it to grow, create new cells, > regenerate, etc, which in turn causes the production of red cells, > white cells and platelets from the activated bone marrow. In addition, > Winstrol is considered to have very mild side effects in comparison to > other anabolic steroids. Winstrol is also found to be very quickly > effective. Most of those athletes who will speak about steroid use, > confirm that Winstrol is one of the most effective and safest of the > drugs (and remember that athletes who are using steroids use them at > hundreds if not thousands of times the recommended doses, and they > "stack" them will all sorts of other steroids). > > I also found, with my own vets, that even with solid proof in front of > their own eyes (with cats condemned to death, showing an amazing > recovery), they will often look for other explanations other than that > it was the Winstrol. As I mentioned with my little Zander, after being > told by every vet I spoke with that there was nothing I could do and > Zander was going to die (and best to put him down immediately), and > being able to show serial blood results weekly which showed a clear > improvement from critical haematology values to normal results, at the > end of it all, I start hearing things like, "well maybe it was never > FeLV in the first place". > > I agree that the way to start turning this around, for all of us who > have had good results or who may have a cat in the unenviable > situation of having little or no other options, is to speak with our > vets about Winstrol. As I have mentioned in previous posts, I have now > used Winstrol, usually in combination with at least the prednisone > (with the doxycycline being added on in circumstances involving > something likely infectious), for a range of cat problems and have had > excellent results every time but once. One case was a 16 year old cat > with a nasal sarcoma (kept the sarcoma from causing severe facial > swelling, and kept my cat eating for another two years); one case was > a cat who came from a feral colony which I later found out had had FIV > rampaging through it and killing all the cats (and she came to me > EXTREMELY ill with a sky-high fever, tympanic abdomen and fluid around > her lungs - she survived when I thought there was no hope at all, and > she's still with me now); I have used it to avoid knee surgery for > Zander when he pulled his cruciate ligament; and am I currently using > it now to treat a spinal lesion in Pippin - a three-year old who gets > flair-ups of neurological problems which I tracked to a spinal lesion, > and when the lesion causes swelling, etc., the symptoms reappear. The > combination of prednisone and Winstrol appears to be the only thing > that reverses the effects of the lesion. > I think the Winstrol is seriously underutilized and cats respond very > well to it, in a number of circumstances. Obviously, it is not a > cure-all, and we've heard from other folks who've tried it and gotten > no appreciable results, so I am not suggesting it is a panacea by any > means. Further, I understand that FeLV is now thought to be caused by > at least four or five different types or strains of virus, and I > believe that this is the reason that some people get amazing results > and some people see nothing. > > Hopefully, Marlene will get a good response, and it is very heartening > to hear that in Italy, the drug is commonly used to treat FeLV cats. > It was commonly used in North America as well, in the '80's and '90's, > until the stupid doping scandals (especially Ben Johnson's Olympic > gold medal being stripped) shone an ugly spotlight on it. > > Amani > > From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 2 16:23:55 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 17:23:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4b151dc7.10f423.15f7e9e78ae.Webtop.50@optonline.net> Hi Ken... I well know the experience of lying with a cat dying of Felv until they passed and these posts are reawakening my own sadnesss and frustration at being able to do so little so late with my own two FelV boys.? It is SO difficult for me to grasp the level of opposition to Winstrol on the part of some vets...? they are surely not worried about law suits and they have a dying cat in front of them that they have NO definitive Tx for....why NOT try Winstrol...? It is beyond absurd...? Unless there is some kind of worry at being fingered for prescibing minute doses of an anabolic steroid ( go ahead...take the dose you would give to a cat and see the AMAZING effect is has...? You'll feel nothing....? I can't help but wonder if a lot of vets think if they wipe out the entire population of FeLV cats that they will effectively wipe out the disease( an odd consideration given that there will always BE a "patient Zero"...? it has to start somewhere and likely would again...?? Then again...anemia is only one of the complications of this damnable disease ( though admittedly the most critical...?? They are driving law abiding citizens into illegal activity trying to find alternative sources of a hard to obtain drug in order to save their cats lives.... it's f-in insane!!! There is no end to the irrationality one can encounter when people who are ' supposed ' to be schooled in scientific thinking decide that , that which stands before them....a winstrol treated cat in recovery from anemia must not have had FeLV or there must be an alternative explanation for the recovery....? Everything BUT trying Winstrol on other cats with the disease and SEEING if it works ..run you own N of 5 or 6 mini experiment and see if you get a a positive result.... It's not as though you are using alternative medicine on a cancer patient that MIGHT have survived had they had proven Tx...?? they have NOTHING to offer us that compares with Winstrol in the clutch ( though to date we have only a very few cats who have survived as a result of taking Winstrol and , to my mind, it has not established itself as the de-facto drug for FeLV instigated anemia...but... it is certainly the most hopeful in a field of paltry competitors.....?? We all want to live with hope, and Winstrol gives us this....? So Ken, by all means, spread the word, pester,implore,cajole your vet into trying it....but don't be too terribly surprised when you have to figure out how to dismantle the brick wall you are likely to encounter.. Bob BTW.... Amani..? are you recommending prednisone or prednisolone with the Doxy...?? many vets insist that prednisone is not useful for cats.. > I couldn?t agree with you more, but I fear that the scientific/medical > evidence is thin because of the really stupid study done a decade ago, > which gave three cats massive doses of Winstrol (same levels as given > to sled dogs) and reported the resulting elevation of liver enzymes. > And then, of course, there is the unhelpful connection to the athletic > doping scandals. Studies looking into the effects of Winstrol are > therefore few and far between (though I have found a few). Moreover, a > physician friend of mine explained to me that once a drug is > off-patent (as Winstrol is) then the drug companies can make very > little money from it, and so they will not spend money to set up > clinical trials, and will instead push other related drugs that are > still covered by a patent, so they make more money on the sale of > those other drugs. > > The problem is that, as far as I can determine to date, though there > are lots of anabolic steroids, Winstrol is the only one that seems to > have this effect on bone marrow to cause it to grow, create new cells, > regenerate, etc, which in turn causes the production of red cells, > white cells and platelets from the activated bone marrow. In addition, > Winstrol is considered to have very mild side effects in comparison to > other anabolic steroids. Winstrol is also found to be very quickly > effective. Most of those athletes who will speak about steroid use, > confirm that Winstrol is one of the most effective and safest of the > drugs (and remember that athletes who are using steroids use them at > hundreds if not thousands of times the recommended doses, and they > "stack" them will all sorts of other steroids). > > I also found, with my own vets, that even with solid proof in front of > their own eyes (with cats condemned to death, showing an amazing > recovery), they will often look for other explanations other than that > it was the Winstrol. As I mentioned with my little Zander, after being > told by every vet I spoke with that there was nothing I could do and > Zander was going to die (and best to put him down immediately), and > being able to show serial blood results weekly which showed a clear > improvement from critical haematology values to normal results, at the > end of it all, I start hearing things like, "well maybe it was never > FeLV in the first place". > > I agree that the way to start turning this around, for all of us who > have had good results or who may have a cat in the unenviable > situation of having little or no other options, is to speak with our > vets about Winstrol. As I have mentioned in previous posts, I have now > used Winstrol, usually in combination with at least the prednisone > (with the doxycycline being added on in circumstances involving > something likely infectious), for a range of cat problems and have had > excellent results every time but once. One case was a 16 year old cat > with a nasal sarcoma (kept the sarcoma from causing severe facial > swelling, and kept my cat eating for another two years); one case was > a cat who came from a feral colony which I later found out had had FIV > rampaging through it and killing all the cats (and she came to me > EXTREMELY ill with a sky-high fever, tympanic abdomen and fluid around > her lungs - she survived when I thought there was no hope at all, and > she's still with me now); I have used it to avoid knee surgery for > Zander when he pulled his cruciate ligament; and am I currently using > it now to treat a spinal lesion in Pippin - a three-year old who gets > flair-ups of neurological problems which I tracked to a spinal lesion, > and when the lesion causes swelling, etc., the symptoms reappear. The > combination of prednisone and Winstrol appears to be the only thing > that reverses the effects of the lesion. > I think the Winstrol is seriously underutilized and cats respond very > well to it, in a number of circumstances. Obviously, it is not a > cure-all, and we've heard from other folks who've tried it and gotten > no appreciable results, so I am not suggesting it is a panacea by any > means. Further, I understand that FeLV is now thought to be caused by > at least four or five different types or strains of virus, and I > believe that this is the reason that some people get amazing results > and some people see nothing. > > Hopefully, Marlene will get a good response, and it is very heartening > to hear that in Italy, the drug is commonly used to treat FeLV cats. > It was commonly used in North America as well, in the '80's and '90's, > until the stupid doping scandals (especially Ben Johnson's Olympic > gold medal being stripped) shone an ugly spotlight on it. > > Amani > > From marlmel at hotmail.com Thu Nov 2 16:30:14 2017 From: marlmel at hotmail.com (marlene melpignano) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 21:30:14 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Stargate and Microbo Message-ID: Dear all, I went to France today, to an oncologic clinic, although I was very uncertain on what's better for my cat. But I think Microbo deserves a proper diagnosis in case there is still hope for treatments. The French vet explained me that he would not suffer for the exam of his bone marrow since they use anesthesia and morphine, and actually he seems fine now, even better than yesterday, he was hungry once back home. The vet thinks that despite the cortisone Microbo has taken, they can find what's wrong with him. He also thinks that Microbo has neither leukemia nor lymphoma. He thinks of something else related to the bone marrow and in one case out of three it would be treatable. The other two scenarios would lead to leukemia in any case. He knew nothing about Winstrol/stargate but wanted all the articles I had. It seems that in France they rather use nandrolone. In one week we will have the result and in the meanwhile I should also get the stargate. I found Sandy's article very interesting and saying the truth: it's not miraculous, but worth trying it when there is nothing we can loose. Now I feel better, since everything I could do has been done, including driving alone back and forth to France for almost 4 hours... but my kitty deserves this and even more. Thanks for being there. Kisses M&M From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 2 16:41:34 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 17:41:34 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] an experiment In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <48335b48.10f45e.15f7eaea0f7.Webtop.50@optonline.net> After imploring all of you to delete redundant posts before posting your notes to the group, I noticed that my last two posts ( where I DID this) STILL had all the redundant posts included in the post.....?? I tend to use REPLY all when responding...and, in turn, seeing my post twice.? This time I am deleting ALL other posts and simply hitting reply...?? If it posts to the group with all the other redundant posts I'll have to ask the advice of the list owner to see if there is an answer.... perhaps it does not bother others as much as it bothers me to have to sift through 20 other messages for the new ones.... so, after this I'll desist? : ) From dlgegg at windstream.net Thu Nov 2 16:46:28 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 16:46:28 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... In-Reply-To: <4b151dc7.10f423.15f7e9e78ae.Webtop.50@optonline.net> Message-ID: <20171102174628.A8R8I.17837.root@pamxwww02-z01> One way to slow down the spread is to spay/neuter all strays, at least there would be less cats to spread the disease. Of course, all cats in homes would also have to be spayed/neutered. Once again, it comes down to owners not being responsible and dumping unwanted kittens or giving them away at Walmart to who knows what kind of person. Around here, many puppies and kittens end up with pitbull breeders who bread for fighting. This is bad, be cause they die a painful death full of fear and the myth is continued that pitbulls are vicious dogs. Ever pit I have met is loving and gentle, but then their owners did not have them for fighting. Should I ever win the Publishers Clearing House sweepstakes, a lot of it will go to helping abused animals, after abused children and seniors. Dorlis ---- ROBERT CHAPEL wrote: > Hi Ken... I well know the experience of lying with a cat dying of Felv until they passed and these posts are reawakening my own sadnesss and frustration at being able to do so little so late with my own two FelV boys.? It is SO difficult for me to grasp the level of opposition to Winstrol on the part of some vets...? they are surely not worried about law suits and they have a dying cat in front of them that they have NO definitive Tx for....why NOT try Winstrol...? It is beyond absurd...? Unless there is some kind of worry at being fingered for prescibing minute doses of an anabolic steroid ( go ahead...take the dose you would give to a cat and see the AMAZING effect is has...? You'll feel nothing....? I can't help but wonder if a lot of vets think if they wipe out the entire population of FeLV cats that they will effectively wipe out the disease( an odd consideration given that there will always BE a "patient Zero"...? it has to start somewhere and likely would again...?? Then again...anemia is only one of the complications of this damnable disease ( though admittedly the most critical...?? They are driving law abiding citizens into illegal activity trying to find alternative sources of a hard to obtain drug in order to save their cats lives.... it's f-in insane!!! There is no end to the irrationality one can encounter when people who are ' supposed ' to be schooled in scientific thinking decide that , that which stands before them....a winstrol treated cat in recovery from anemia must not have had FeLV or there must be an alternative explanation for the recovery....? Everything BUT trying Winstrol on other cats with the disease and SEEING if it works ..run you own N of 5 or 6 mini experiment and see if you get a a positive result.... It's not as though you are using alternative medicine on a cancer patient that MIGHT have survived had they had proven Tx...?? they have NOTHING to offer us that compares with Winstrol in the clutch ( though to date we have only a very few cats who have survived as a result of taking Winstrol and , to my mind, it has not established itself as the de-facto drug for FeLV instigated anemia...but... it is certainly the most hopeful in a field of paltry competitors.....?? We all want to live with hope, and Winstrol gives us this....? So Ken, by all means, spread the word, pester,implore,cajole your vet into trying it....but don't be too terribly surprised when you have to figure out how to dismantle the brick wall you are likely to encounter.. Bob BTW.... Amani..? are you recommending prednisone or prednisolone with the Doxy...?? many vets insist that prednisone is not useful for cats.. > I couldn?t agree with you more, but I fear that the scientific/medical > evidence is thin because of the really stupid study done a decade ago, > which gave three cats massive doses of Winstrol (same levels as given > to sled dogs) and reported the resulting elevation of liver enzymes. > And then, of course, there is the unhelpful connection to the athletic > doping scandals. Studies looking into the effects of Winstrol are > therefore few and far between (though I have found a few). Moreover, a > physician friend of mine explained to me that once a drug is > off-patent (as Winstrol is) then the drug companies can make very > little money from it, and so they will not spend money to set up > clinical trials, and will instead push other related drugs that are > still covered by a patent, so they make more money on the sale of > those other drugs. > > The problem is that, as far as I can determine to date, though there > are lots of anabolic steroids, Winstrol is the only one that seems to > have this effect on bone marrow to cause it to grow, create new cells, > regenerate, etc, which in turn causes the production of red cells, > white cells and platelets from the activated bone marrow. In addition, > Winstrol is considered to have very mild side effects in comparison to > other anabolic steroids. Winstrol is also found to be very quickly > effective. Most of those athletes who will speak about steroid use, > confirm that Winstrol is one of the most effective and safest of the > drugs (and remember that athletes who are using steroids use them at > hundreds if not thousands of times the recommended doses, and they > "stack" them will all sorts of other steroids). > > I also found, with my own vets, that even with solid proof in front of > their own eyes (with cats condemned to death, showing an amazing > recovery), they will often look for other explanations other than that > it was the Winstrol. As I mentioned with my little Zander, after being > told by every vet I spoke with that there was nothing I could do and > Zander was going to die (and best to put him down immediately), and > being able to show serial blood results weekly which showed a clear > improvement from critical haematology values to normal results, at the > end of it all, I start hearing things like, "well maybe it was never > FeLV in the first place". > > I agree that the way to start turning this around, for all of us who > have had good results or who may have a cat in the unenviable > situation of having little or no other options, is to speak with our > vets about Winstrol. As I have mentioned in previous posts, I have now > used Winstrol, usually in combination with at least the prednisone > (with the doxycycline being added on in circumstances involving > something likely infectious), for a range of cat problems and have had > excellent results every time but once. One case was a 16 year old cat > with a nasal sarcoma (kept the sarcoma from causing severe facial > swelling, and kept my cat eating for another two years); one case was > a cat who came from a feral colony which I later found out had had FIV > rampaging through it and killing all the cats (and she came to me > EXTREMELY ill with a sky-high fever, tympanic abdomen and fluid around > her lungs - she survived when I thought there was no hope at all, and > she's still with me now); I have used it to avoid knee surgery for > Zander when he pulled his cruciate ligament; and am I currently using > it now to treat a spinal lesion in Pippin - a three-year old who gets > flair-ups of neurological problems which I tracked to a spinal lesion, > and when the lesion causes swelling, etc., the symptoms reappear. The > combination of prednisone and Winstrol appears to be the only thing > that reverses the effects of the lesion. > I think the Winstrol is seriously underutilized and cats respond very > well to it, in a number of circumstances. Obviously, it is not a > cure-all, and we've heard from other folks who've tried it and gotten > no appreciable results, so I am not suggesting it is a panacea by any > means. Further, I understand that FeLV is now thought to be caused by > at least four or five different types or strains of virus, and I > believe that this is the reason that some people get amazing results > and some people see nothing. > > Hopefully, Marlene will get a good response, and it is very heartening > to hear that in Italy, the drug is commonly used to treat FeLV cats. > It was commonly used in North America as well, in the '80's and '90's, > until the stupid doping scandals (especially Ben Johnson's Olympic > gold medal being stripped) shone an ugly spotlight on it. > > Amani > > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From felinerescue at frontier.com Thu Nov 2 17:57:56 2017 From: felinerescue at frontier.com (Lorrie) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 18:57:56 -0400 Subject: [Felvtalk] erasing redundant posts... In-Reply-To: <6c36c275.10f30a.15f7e6db832.Webtop.50@optonline.net> References: <6c36c275.10f30a.15f7e6db832.Webtop.50@optonline.net> Message-ID: <20171102225756.GB837@lnx12.netgear.com> THANK YOU BOB. I have repeatedly asked people in all my cat groups to delete old messages and change the subject on the subject line when the topic changes. I think you and I are the only ones doing this! BTW, I run Linux, not Microsoft, and it is easy for me to do this, I wonder if it is difficult with Microsoft, which most people use, or are people just too busy, don't bother, or what? Lorrie On 11-02, ROBERT CHAPEL wrote: > PLEASE folks... > A lot of us could be missing important information while leafing through > 20 previously posted messages and not noticing the ONE that is > new...???? It is frustrating sometimes that I will go to the trouble of > deleting everything and then see it reappear anyway.... I don't get > it... BUT... still worth the effort for the time that it DOES work... > I'll check and HOPE that this on doesn't include everything that went > before?? : ) > > > Bob in Warwick ny From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Thu Nov 2 17:58:29 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 22:58:29 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] FW: Stargate? In-Reply-To: <1698542976.20042677.1509656910392.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net> References: <65d654ac.10f344.15f7e76d993.Webtop.50@optonline.net> <1698542976.20042677.1509656910392.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net> Message-ID: Sandy I cannot tell you how happy your post, below, makes me. Much of what is in the Drs. Fosters & Smith website, sounds like it was taken from my hundreds of posts, verbatim. I feel a little vindicated, because most of this stuff I worked out on my own by observation, lab testing, researching etc. My hypotheses were just that. Seeing this stuff posted, and looking like it came from an interview with me, helps me to stop wondering at times if I am just plain crazy, since no one else seemed to know or understand this stuff ? especially the vets. I didn?t know of the second anabolic steroid ? nandrolone. I have no idea if it is as good as the Winstrol, but it would be nice if there were additional options rather than just Winstrol. A couple of things though. Dogs have had good responses to Winstrol as well, but they suffer far more from the side-effects than cats do. Also, Winstrol has very little of the androgenic side-effects, like virilisation ? even in human athletes. Winstrol is considered pretty safe in that regard. As I am mentioned as recently as my post today though, Winstrol is very good for a whole lot of conditions. It?s ability to regenerate bone marrow and get red cell, white cell and platelet production increased, is what makes it very helpful in treating FeLV cats. But it has applications in many, many conditions where cats (and dogs, and sheep and horses ? studies show), are run-down, ill, ailing, not eating, wasting away, etc. Boy, does it feel good to know that I am not alone, crying in the wilderness about this stuff! Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy Sent: November-02-17 5:09 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Stargate? The Androgen Group-Anabolic Steroids Veterinary & Aquatic Services Department, Drs. Foster & Smith [Alt. Medicine] Print Article | Email Article [Bookmark and Share] [Click here for a pdf version of this article.] [See related products at DrsFosterSmith.com Pet Supplies] This is from the Drs. Fosters & Smith website - for anyone interested Sandy W These compounds are related to the male hormone testosterone. They are referred to as the anabolic steroids because they cause the formation of new proteins. As we stated before, they are often abused by athletes trying to increase strength and muscle mass. Their use in canine medicine, while infrequent, is related to these and similar properties. Anabolic steroids come in liquid forms for injection and tablets for oral administration. Two of the most commonly used in canine medicine are stanozolol (Winstrol-V) and nandrolone (DecaDurabolin). Animals that have been sick for a long time or who have been through severe, debilitating injuries often have generalized weakness and atrophied muscles. In some, this has progressed to the point where the animals can no longer walk or even stand. Their bodies are just too run down, and without some outside stimulation, they simply may give up the will to live. Anabolic steroids are sometimes useful in these situations. The therapy may take several weeks. The medications can be most helpful if the veterinarian recognizes the condition before too much strength is lost. Anabolic steroids assist the body in regaining its muscle mass by building new proteins, which are the primary constituent of muscle fibers. Additionally, they help strengthen existing muscles. In some of these same cases, anabolic steroids are frequently used to stimulate the debilitated or recovering patient's appetite. To achieve this effect usually requires several days to several weeks of therapy for significant changes. The anabolic steroids are also useful in treating certain types of anemia. Anemia is the term used to describe lower than normal numbers of red blood cells (RBCs). In certain cases where the bone marrow has stopped producing new RBCs, administration of anabolic steroids will stimulate this system and bring the number of these cells back to normal levels. They also are known to stimulate the production of white blood cells and platelets (tiny cells in blood that assist in clotting) to a lesser degree. In these situations, the anabolic steroids are useful only in increasing the numbers of these cells. They do not increase the ability of the cells to function. Kidney failure often brings on anemia because these organs may fail to produce the substance erythropoietin. Its normal function is to monitor the level of RBCs in the body and to stimulate the bone marrow to increase production when RBC numbers are too low. In its absence, anabolic steroids are often useful in reversing the effects of this anemia. They do not cause new erythropoietin to be produced; they only replace its function. In many situations, the anabolic steroids fail to provide the benefits described here. Regardless of which particular product is used, it is often impossible to reverse the condition present. These are not miracle drugs that can save every debilitated or severely ill patient, but in some they can help. As stated, these medications are closely related to testosterone and many of the problems associated with their usage are brought on by the normal actions of the male hormones. They can cause cessation of heat cycles and imitation mounting behavior in females. In males, they have been found to increase the incidence of prostate disease and certain hernias and tumors that are caused by normal testosterone levels in older male dogs. Normal sperm production is often disrupted, with few new cells being formed. None of these problems are considered significant in these cases, as many of the patients are already in a life or death situation. Anabolic steroids also cause water retention and this can cause additional complications in kidney or heart failure patients. These products also increase the absorption of calcium by the intestinal tract and cause the kidneys to retain calcium during normal urine production. Both of these actions lead to excessively high calcium levels in the blood which can be disastrous to normal heart function. This can be quickly fatal in those with already failing hearts. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: ATT00001.txt URL: From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Thu Nov 2 18:02:11 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 23:02:11 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... In-Reply-To: <4b151dc7.10f423.15f7e9e78ae.Webtop.50@optonline.net> References: <4b151dc7.10f423.15f7e9e78ae.Webtop.50@optonline.net> Message-ID: Hi Bob When I was treating Zander, all the vets were using prednisone on cats, so that is what I used on Zander. I don?t agree it is useless. I have used prednisone on other cats, with good result. However, I now understand that prednisolone is a derivative of prednisone and is better and safer for cats. This is my understanding as to why this was changed, but I have heard from vets that the two are interchangeable in terms of dosage, etc. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of ROBERT CHAPEL Sent: November-02-17 5:24 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Cc: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... Hi Ken... I well know the experience of lying with a cat dying of Felv until they passed and these posts are reawakening my own sadnesss and frustration at being able to do so little so late with my own two FelV boys.? It is SO difficult for me to grasp the level of opposition to Winstrol on the part of some vets...? they are surely not worried about law suits and they have a dying cat in front of them that they have NO definitive Tx for....why NOT try Winstrol...? It is beyond absurd...? Unless there is some kind of worry at being fingered for prescibing minute doses of an anabolic steroid ( go ahead...take the dose you would give to a cat and see the AMAZING effect is has...? You'll feel nothing....? I can't help but wonder if a lot of vets think if they wipe out the entire population of FeLV cats that they will effectively wipe out the disease( an odd consideration given that there will always BE a "patient Zero"...? it has to start somewhere and likely would again...?? Then again...anemia is only one of the complications of this damnable disease ( though admittedly the most critical...?? They are driving law abiding citizens into illegal activity trying to find alternative sources of a hard to obtain drug in order to save their cats lives.... it's f-in insane!!! There is no end to the irrationality one can encounter when people who are ' supposed ' to be schooled in scientific thinking decide that , that which stands before them....a winstrol treated cat in recovery from anemia must not have had FeLV or there must be an alternative explanation for the recovery....? Everything BUT trying Winstrol on other cats with the disease and SEEING if it works ..run you own N of 5 or 6 mini experiment and see if you get a a positive result.... It's not as though you are using alternative medicine on a cancer patient that MIGHT have survived had they had proven Tx...?? they have NOTHING to offer us that compares with Winstrol in the clutch ( though to date we have only a very few cats who have survived as a result of taking Winstrol and , to my mind, it has not established itself as the de-facto drug for FeLV instigated anemia...but... it is certainly the most hopeful in a field of paltry competitors.....?? We all want to live with hope, and Winstrol gives us this....? So Ken, by all means, spread the word, pester,implore,cajole your vet into trying it....but don't be too terribly surprised when you have to figure out how to dismantle the brick wall you are likely to encounter.. Bob BTW.... Amani..? are you recommending prednisone or prednisolone with the Doxy...?? many vets insist that prednisone is not useful for cats.. From swacht1946 at comcast.net Thu Nov 2 20:38:28 2017 From: swacht1946 at comcast.net (Sandy) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 01:38:28 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Felvtalk] FW: Stargate? In-Reply-To: References: <65d654ac.10f344.15f7e76d993.Webtop.50@optonline.net> <1698542976.20042677.1509656910392.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net> Message-ID: <177239946.20272553.1509673108811.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net> sure happy to know that article is a good thing for "us". Just happened to pop-up Sandy W ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amani Oakley" To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 6:58:29 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] FW: Stargate? Sandy I cannot tell you how happy your post, below, makes me. Much of what is in the Drs. Fosters & Smith website, sounds like it was taken from my hundreds of posts, verbatim. I feel a little vindicated, because most of this stuff I worked out on my own by observation, lab testing, researching etc. My hypotheses were just that. Seeing this stuff posted, and looking like it came from an interview with me, helps me to stop wondering at times if I am just plain crazy, since no one else seemed to know or understand this stuff ? especially the vets. I didn?t know of the second anabolic steroid ? nandrolone. I have no idea if it is as good as the Winstrol, but it would be nice if there were additional options rather than just Winstrol. A couple of things though. Dogs have had good responses to Winstrol as well, but they suffer far more from the side-effects than cats do. Also, Winstrol has very little of the androgenic side-effects, like virilisation ? even in human athletes. Winstrol is considered pretty safe in that regard. As I am mentioned as recently as my post today though, Winstrol is very good for a whole lot of conditions. It?s ability to regenerate bone marrow and get red cell, white cell and platelet production increased, is what makes it very helpful in treating FeLV cats. But it has applications in many, many conditions where cats (and dogs, and sheep and horses ? studies show), are run-down, ill, ailing, not eating, wasting away, etc. Boy, does it feel good to know that I am not alone, crying in the wilderness about this stuff! Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Sandy Sent: November-02-17 5:09 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Stargate? The Androgen Group-Anabolic Steroids Veterinary & Aquatic Services Department, Drs. Foster & Smith Print Article | Email Article This is from the Drs. Fosters & Smith website - for anyone interested Sandy W These compounds are related to the male hormone testosterone. They are referred to as the anabolic steroids because they cause the formation of new proteins. As we stated before, they are often abused by athletes trying to increase strength and muscle mass. Their use in canine medicine, while infrequent, is related to these and similar properties. Anabolic steroids come in liquid forms for injection and tablets for oral administration. Two of the most commonly used in canine medicine are stanozolol (Winstrol-V) and nandrolone (DecaDurabolin). Animals that have been sick for a long time or who have been through severe, debilitating injuries often have generalized weakness and atrophied muscles. In some, this has progressed to the point where the animals can no longer walk or even stand. Their bodies are just too run down, and without some outside stimulation, they simply may give up the will to live. Anabolic steroids are sometimes useful in these situations. The therapy may take several weeks. The medications can be most helpful if the veterinarian recognizes the condition before too much strength is lost. Anabolic steroids assist the body in regaining its muscle mass by building new proteins, which are the primary constituent of muscle fibers. Additionally, they help strengthen existing muscles. In some of these same cases, anabolic steroids are frequently used to stimulate the debilitated or recovering patient's appetite. To achieve this effect usually requires several days to several weeks of therapy for significant changes. The anabolic steroids are also useful in treating certain types of anemia . Anemia is the term used to describe lower than normal numbers of red blood cells (RBCs). In certain cases where the bone marrow has stopped producing new RBCs, administration of anabolic steroids will stimulate this system and bring the number of these cells back to normal levels. They also are known to stimulate the production of white blood cells and platelets (tiny cells in blood that assist in clotting) to a lesser degree. In these situations, the anabolic steroids are useful only in increasing the numbers of these cells. They do not increase the ability of the cells to function . Kidney failure often brings on anemia because these organs may fail to produce the substance erythropoietin. Its normal function is to monitor the level of RBCs in the body and to stimulate the bone marrow to increase production when RBC numbers are too low. In its absence, anabolic steroids are often useful in reversing the effects of this anemia. They do not cause new erythropoietin to be produced; they only replace its function. In many situations, the anabolic steroids fail to provide the benefits described here. Regardless of which particular product is used, it is often impossible to reverse the condition present. These are not miracle drugs that can save every debilitated or severely ill patient, but in some they can help. As stated, these medications are closely related to testosterone and many of the problems associated with their usage are brought on by the normal actions of the male hormones. They can cause cessation of heat cycles and imitation mounting behavior in females. In males, they have been found to increase the incidence of prostate disease and certain hernias and tumors that are caused by normal testosterone levels in older male dogs. Normal sperm production is often disrupted, with few new cells being formed. None of these problems are considered significant in these cases, as many of the patients are already in a life or death situation. Anabolic steroids also cause water retention and this can cause additional complications in kidney or heart failure patients. These products also increase the absorption of calcium by the intestinal tract and cause the kidneys to retain calcium during normal urine production. Both of these actions lead to excessively high calcium levels in the blood which can be disastrous to normal heart function. This can be quickly fatal in those with already failing hearts. _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 2 21:52:07 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 22:52:07 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 8 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2f886d6f.10f792.15f7fcaf456.Webtop.50@optonline.net> Amani... I think I overstated myself with the prednisone... IThe explanation I got was that the active metabolite of prednisone is prednisolone which actually does the work and the animal needs to be able to make this conversion.... There appears to be some question as to the feline ability to make this conversion ( I would add....reliably...because it is clear that some cats HAVE profitted greatly from prednisone.... The question I have is IF the active metabolite is what is doing the work... why would , anyone, prescribe prednisone???? ..... gets confusing ...no?? On Thu, Nov 02, 2017 at 09:38 PM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: > Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 23:02:11 +0000 > From: Amani Oakley To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: Re: > [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Hi Bob > > When I was treating Zander, all the vets were using prednisone on > cats, so that is what I used on Zander. I don?t agree it is useless. I > have used prednisone on other cats, with good result. However, I now > understand that prednisolone is a derivative of prednisone and is > better and safer for cats. This is my understanding as to why this was > changed, but I have heard from vets that the two are interchangeable > in terms of dosage, etc. > > Amani > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 8 > *************************************** > From toomanykitties2 at earthlink.net Fri Nov 3 05:33:43 2017 From: toomanykitties2 at earthlink.net (Margo) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 06:33:43 -0400 (GMT-04:00) Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Message-ID: <84168034.174.1509705223480@wamui-jasmine.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Hi Ken, Would you be willing to share your compilation so others could print for their Vets, as well? I keep trying to get it all together, but I can't seem to be cohesive. I think it would be very helpful :) Thanks, Margo -----Original Message----- >From: kresch831 at mchsi.com >Sent: Nov 2, 2017 10:18 AM >To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > >Good Morningh all-- >I've been following the posts to Marlene and others regarding Winstrol/Stargate. I began following when my feral-turned-wonderful-domestic Tuxedo, Zorro, became ill with FeLV. We tried the Prednisolone route and he perked up for a week or so but then just slept more and more as his red count bottomed out. I laid next to him as he died and shared that with all of you at that time. What I'm writing about now is what we must do for future cats that may contract FeLV. I have printed the pertinent information that began with Amani and then others regarding Winstrol and Stargate minus any links and email addresses. I am taking this info to my Vet and telling her to start her research immediately. I will also tell her she could be the first Vet in our area to truly treat our kitties with a drug that works. If we all present the information we've been sharing we will begin a ground-swell of interest and hope. >Ken >----- Original Message ----- >From: dlgegg at windstream.net >To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >Sent: Thu, 02 Nov 2017 09:21:32 -0400 (EDT) >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > >Prayers for you and your baby. > >---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear all, >> Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. >> What is better, pills or injections? >> I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . >> I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. >> >> Thanks all for your support. >> Best >> M&M >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> >> > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >> > >> > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >> > >> > Ardy >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net >> > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >> > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help >> > >> > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >> > >> > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> >> Dear All, >> >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). >> >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... >> >> >> >> Thanks for your help >> >> Marl?ne >> >> >> >> >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Felvtalk mailing list >> > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> > >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Felvtalk mailing list >> > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Felvtalk mailing list >> > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From toomanykitties2 at earthlink.net Fri Nov 3 05:39:31 2017 From: toomanykitties2 at earthlink.net (Margo) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 06:39:31 -0400 (GMT-04:00) Subject: [Felvtalk] erasing redundant posts... Message-ID: <1602140969.198.1509705571421@wamui-jasmine.atl.sa.earthlink.net> I guess it's individual preference. I doagree with changing subject, in the form of "New Topic/was Old Topic" But I like not having to log in and search to find what has gone before. I always get doubles of Bob's posts. I'll try to remember to delete. Margo Well took three sections to delete. I'll just read. From toomanykitties2 at earthlink.net Fri Nov 3 05:50:47 2017 From: toomanykitties2 at earthlink.net (Margo) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 06:50:47 -0400 (GMT-04:00) Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... Message-ID: <617106842.276.1509706247794@wamui-jasmine.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Prenisolone and prednisone are interchangeable. Most Vet's (mine is not one) believe that prednisolone is better utilized by cats, because one step of the metabolization process is eliminated. Prednisone must be processed into prednisolone in the liver beofre cats can use it. "Why are there two versions of this catabolic steroid? First of all, if the thought of steroids and cats causes you to picture your cat gaining muscle mass and getting ripped, those performance-enhancing drugs are anabolic steroids, which build up. Catabolic steroids do the opposite; they break down. A cat?s liver processes prednisone, turning it into prednisolone. Prednisolone, then, is prescribed for cats with weak or compromised livers." (from http://www.catster.com/lifestyle/prednisone-for-cats) And while my Vet doesn't believe it much matters, she has prescribed prednisolone for me to have on hand, so I can do things my way... -----Original Message----- >From: Amani Oakley >Sent: Nov 2, 2017 7:02 PM >To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... > >Hi Bob > >When I was treating Zander, all the vets were using prednisone on cats, so that is what I used on Zander. I don?t agree it is useless. I have used prednisone on other cats, with good result. However, I now understand that prednisolone is a derivative of prednisone and is better and safer for cats. This is my understanding as to why this was changed, but I have heard from vets that the two are interchangeable in terms of dosage, etc. > >Amani From kresch831 at mchsi.com Fri Nov 3 09:55:45 2017 From: kresch831 at mchsi.com (kresch831 at mchsi.com) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 10:55:45 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Message-ID: <1509016351.434666408.1509720945967.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Dear Kitty Friends, I've attached a number of exchanges regarding the use of Winstrol to combat FeLV. I;m taking my compilation to my vet and telling her (well firmly asking) to read through the information and begin to do her own research. Our vets need to do at least two pieces of research/investigation. First, they need to research the efficacy of using steroids on cats and secondly, they need to find legal supply routes to obtain Winstrol/Stargate. If I've missed any significant parts of our exchanges, please tell me and resend those parts. I'll add them to what we have and it will all be in one place. Thanks to all of you for weighing in on this critical subject -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Feline Leukemia notes.docx Type: application/vnd.openxmlformats-officedocument.wordprocessingml.document Size: 21122 bytes Desc: not available URL: From marlmel at hotmail.com Fri Nov 3 09:58:07 2017 From: marlmel at hotmail.com (marlene melpignano) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 14:58:07 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Stargate Message-ID: Sorry for spamming, but I wanted to share my joy with you. My friend just brought me the stargate. I am proud of my country, my Italian vet, the Italian pharmacist, my family and my friends that arranged everything in less than 12 hours. Maybe it won't have any effects, but with all their contributions they are giving me the possibility to try. Above all my country that kept it legal for animals, despite all the stupid humans abusing of it. And thanks to Ardy, Sandy, Amani, Lorrie, dlgegg and you all for the support. Marl?ne and Microbo [cid:1c57407f-6d40-4c55-874f-2de3209e986e at eurprd09.prod.outlook.com] Inviato da iPhone -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: FullSizeRender.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 28019 bytes Desc: FullSizeRender.jpg URL: From dlgegg at windstream.net Fri Nov 3 16:02:16 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 16:02:16 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Stargate In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20171103170216.PXMH4.6212.root@pamxwww10-z01> No appology necessary. It is great news that someone besides us cares enough to do what is right. ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Sorry for spamming, but I wanted to share my joy with you. > My friend just brought me the stargate. > I am proud of my country, my Italian vet, the Italian pharmacist, my family and my friends that arranged everything in less than 12 hours. > Maybe it won't have any effects, but with all their contributions they are giving me the possibility to try. > Above all my country that kept it legal for animals, despite all the stupid humans abusing of it. > And thanks to Ardy, Sandy, Amani, Lorrie, dlgegg and you all for the support. > Marl?ne and Microbo > > > > [cid:1c57407f-6d40-4c55-874f-2de3209e986e at eurprd09.prod.outlook.com] > > > > > Inviato da iPhone From dlgegg at windstream.net Fri Nov 3 16:04:17 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 16:04:17 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol In-Reply-To: <1509016351.434666408.1509720945967.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <20171103170417.YVS9O.6218.root@pamxwww10-z01> Good for you! That is what I did and my vet was impressed with the amount of information and said it certainly was worth investigating. More people should give vets a nudge to get them to research before saying no. ---- kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: > Dear Kitty Friends, > I've attached a number of exchanges regarding the use of Winstrol to combat FeLV. I;m taking my compilation to my vet and telling her (well firmly asking) to read through the information and begin to do her own research. Our vets need to do at least two pieces of research/investigation. First, they need to research the efficacy of using steroids on cats and secondly, they need to find legal supply routes to obtain Winstrol/Stargate. If I've missed any significant parts of our exchanges, please tell me and resend those parts. I'll add them to what we have and it will all be in one place. Thanks to all of you for weighing in on this critical subject From dlgegg at windstream.net Fri Nov 3 16:27:49 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 16:27:49 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... In-Reply-To: <617106842.276.1509706247794@wamui-jasmine.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20171103172749.ALAC4.6284.root@pamxwww10-z01> That is one step in the right direction and who knows she might just do some research or read your information and change her mind. ---- Margo wrote: > Prenisolone and prednisone are interchangeable. Most Vet's (mine is not one) believe that prednisolone is better utilized by cats, because one step of the metabolization process is eliminated. Prednisone must be processed into prednisolone in the liver beofre cats can use it. "Why are there two versions of this catabolic steroid? First of all, if the thought of steroids and cats causes you to picture your cat gaining muscle mass and getting ripped, those performance-enhancing drugs are anabolic steroids, which build up. Catabolic steroids do the opposite; they break down. A cat?s liver processes prednisone, turning it into prednisolone. Prednisolone, then, is prescribed for cats with weak or compromised livers." (from http://www.catster.com/lifestyle/prednisone-for-cats) And while my Vet doesn't believe it much matters, she has prescribed prednisolone for me to have on hand, so I can do things my way... -----Original Message----- >From: Amani Oakley >Sent: Nov 2, 2017 7:02 PM >To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Winstrol.... > >Hi Bob > >When I was treating Zander, all the vets were using prednisone on cats, so that is what I used on Zander. I don?t agree it is useless. I have used prednisone on other cats, with good result. However, I now understand that prednisolone is a derivative of prednisone and is better and safer for cats. This is my understanding as to why this was changed, but I have heard from vets that the two are interchangeable in terms of dosage, etc. > >Amani _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From dlgegg at windstream.net Fri Nov 3 16:28:40 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 16:28:40 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: <84168034.174.1509705223480@wamui-jasmine.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20171103172840.FWU6T.6287.root@pamxwww10-z01> I also like this. ---- Margo wrote: > Hi Ken, Would you be willing to share your compilation so others could print for their Vets, as well? I keep trying to get it all together, but I can't seem to be cohesive. I think it would be very helpful :) Thanks, Margo -----Original Message----- >From: kresch831 at mchsi.com >Sent: Nov 2, 2017 10:18 AM >To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > >Good Morningh all-- >I've been following the posts to Marlene and others regarding Winstrol/Stargate. I began following when my feral-turned-wonderful-domestic Tuxedo, Zorro, became ill with FeLV. We tried the Prednisolone route and he perked up for a week or so but then just slept more and more as his red count bottomed out. I laid next to him as he died and shared that with all of you at that time. What I'm writing about now is what we must do for future cats that may contract FeLV. I have printed the pertinent information that began with Amani and then others regarding Winstrol and Stargate minus any links and email addresses. I am taking this info to my Vet and telling her to start her research immediately. I will also tell her she could be the first Vet in our area to truly treat our kitties with a drug that works. If we all present the information we've been sharing we will begin a ground-swell of interest and hope. >Ken >----- Original Message ----- >From: dlgegg at windstream.net >To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >Sent: Thu, 02 Nov 2017 09:21:32 -0400 (EDT) >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > >Prayers for you and your baby. > >---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear all, >> Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. >> What is better, pills or injections? >> I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . >> I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. >> >> Thanks all for your support. >> Best >> M&M >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> >> > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: >> > >> > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! >> > >> > Ardy >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net >> > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM >> > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help >> > >> > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you >> > >> > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> >> Dear All, >> >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). >> >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... >> >> >> >> Thanks for your help >> >> Marl?ne >> >> >> >> >> >> Inviato da iPhone >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Felvtalk mailing list >> > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> > >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Felvtalk mailing list >> > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Felvtalk mailing list >> > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From swacht1946 at comcast.net Fri Nov 3 17:31:44 2017 From: swacht1946 at comcast.net (Sandy) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 22:31:44 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Felvtalk] Stargate In-Reply-To: <20171103170216.PXMH4.6212.root@pamxwww10-z01> References: <20171103170216.PXMH4.6212.root@pamxwww10-z01> Message-ID: <1712664318.21270971.1509748304244.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net> Happy Tails!! Sandy W ----- Original Message ----- From: dlgegg at windstream.net To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Friday, November 3, 2017 5:02:16 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Stargate No appology necessary. It is great news that someone besides us cares enough to do what is right. ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Sorry for spamming, but I wanted to share my joy with you. > My friend just brought me the stargate. > I am proud of my country, my Italian vet, the Italian pharmacist, my family and my friends that arranged everything in less than 12 hours. > Maybe it won't have any effects, but with all their contributions they are giving me the possibility to try. > Above all my country that kept it legal for animals, despite all the stupid humans abusing of it. > And thanks to Ardy, Sandy, Amani, Lorrie, dlgegg and you all for the support. > Marl?ne and Microbo > > > > [cid:1c57407f-6d40-4c55-874f-2de3209e986e at eurprd09.prod.outlook.com] > > > > > Inviato da iPhone _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Sat Nov 4 09:13:29 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 14:13:29 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol In-Reply-To: <1509016351.434666408.1509720945967.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> References: <1509016351.434666408.1509720945967.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: I will email you directly with a bunch of other articles I have compiled, including the original scientific publication which appears to have started the whole hysteria regarding liver failure in cats being caused by Winstrol. I have highlighted and notated the study so you can see how very poorly designed the study is, and the serious flaws with their logic and conclusions. I don?t think I can post attachments to this chatline. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-03-17 10:56 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Dear Kitty Friends, I've attached a number of exchanges regarding the use of Winstrol to combat FeLV. I;m taking my compilation to my vet and telling her (well firmly asking) to read through the information and begin to do her own research. Our vets need to do at least two pieces of research/investigation. First, they need to research the efficacy of using steroids on cats and secondly, they need to find legal supply routes to obtain Winstrol/Stargate. If I've missed any significant parts of our exchanges, please tell me and resend those parts. I'll add them to what we have and it will all be in one place. Thanks to all of you for weighing in on this critical subject From kresch831 at mchsi.com Sat Nov 4 10:02:11 2017 From: kresch831 at mchsi.com (kresch831 at mchsi.com) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 11:02:11 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1935531886.437521915.1509807731943.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Hi Amani, Yes, send what you have to kresch831 at mchsi.com and I'll add them to our chat pieces and resend the whole "dossier" as an attachment to the chat line. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: Amani Oakley To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, 04 Nov 2017 10:13:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol I will email you directly with a bunch of other articles I have compiled, including the original scientific publication which appears to have started the whole hysteria regarding liver failure in cats being caused by Winstrol. I have highlighted and notated the study so you can see how very poorly designed the study is, and the serious flaws with their logic and conclusions. I don?t think I can post attachments to this chatline. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-03-17 10:56 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Dear Kitty Friends, I've attached a number of exchanges regarding the use of Winstrol to combat FeLV. I;m taking my compilation to my vet and telling her (well firmly asking) to read through the information and begin to do her own research. Our vets need to do at least two pieces of research/investigation. First, they need to research the efficacy of using steroids on cats and secondly, they need to find legal supply routes to obtain Winstrol/Stargate. If I've missed any significant parts of our exchanges, please tell me and resend those parts. I'll add them to what we have and it will all be in one place. Thanks to all of you for weighing in on this critical subject _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Sat Nov 4 10:03:27 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 15:03:27 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol In-Reply-To: <1935531886.437521915.1509807731943.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> References: <1935531886.437521915.1509807731943.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: I sent it already. There were a lot of attachments, so check your Junk Mailbox in case it ended up in there. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-04-17 11:02 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Hi Amani, Yes, send what you have to kresch831 at mchsi.com and I'll add them to our chat pieces and resend the whole "dossier" as an attachment to the chat line. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: Amani Oakley To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, 04 Nov 2017 10:13:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol I will email you directly with a bunch of other articles I have compiled, including the original scientific publication which appears to have started the whole hysteria regarding liver failure in cats being caused by Winstrol. I have highlighted and notated the study so you can see how very poorly designed the study is, and the serious flaws with their logic and conclusions. I don?t think I can post attachments to this chatline. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-03-17 10:56 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Dear Kitty Friends, I've attached a number of exchanges regarding the use of Winstrol to combat FeLV. I;m taking my compilation to my vet and telling her (well firmly asking) to read through the information and begin to do her own research. Our vets need to do at least two pieces of research/investigation. First, they need to research the efficacy of using steroids on cats and secondly, they need to find legal supply routes to obtain Winstrol/Stargate. If I've missed any significant parts of our exchanges, please tell me and resend those parts. I'll add them to what we have and it will all be in one place. Thanks to all of you for weighing in on this critical subject _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From kresch831 at mchsi.com Sat Nov 4 10:07:28 2017 From: kresch831 at mchsi.com (kresch831 at mchsi.com) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 11:07:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <336333270.437532615.1509808048660.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> I found them. I'll edit out address material and put all the pieces together as one dossier on the subject. Looks like you've done a massive amount of research! I believe if we offer this to our vets, they just may start to take nbotice. I'll get this out over the weekend. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: Amani Oakley To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, 04 Nov 2017 11:03:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol I sent it already. There were a lot of attachments, so check your Junk Mailbox in case it ended up in there. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-04-17 11:02 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Hi Amani, Yes, send what you have to kresch831 at mchsi.com and I'll add them to our chat pieces and resend the whole "dossier" as an attachment to the chat line. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: Amani Oakley To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, 04 Nov 2017 10:13:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol I will email you directly with a bunch of other articles I have compiled, including the original scientific publication which appears to have started the whole hysteria regarding liver failure in cats being caused by Winstrol. I have highlighted and notated the study so you can see how very poorly designed the study is, and the serious flaws with their logic and conclusions. I don?t think I can post attachments to this chatline. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-03-17 10:56 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Dear Kitty Friends, I've attached a number of exchanges regarding the use of Winstrol to combat FeLV. I;m taking my compilation to my vet and telling her (well firmly asking) to read through the information and begin to do her own research. Our vets need to do at least two pieces of research/investigation. First, they need to research the efficacy of using steroids on cats and secondly, they need to find legal supply routes to obtain Winstrol/Stargate. If I've missed any significant parts of our exchanges, please tell me and resend those parts. I'll add them to what we have and it will all be in one place. Thanks to all of you for weighing in on this critical subject _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From dlgegg at windstream.net Sat Nov 4 11:17:04 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 11:17:04 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol In-Reply-To: <336333270.437532615.1509808048660.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <20171104121704.GPQVK.6038.root@pamxwww06-z01> Thank you. ---- kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: > I found them. I'll edit out address material and put all the pieces together as one dossier on the subject. Looks like you've done a massive amount of research! I believe if we offer this to our vets, they just may start to take nbotice. I'll get this out over the weekend. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: Amani Oakley To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, 04 Nov 2017 11:03:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol I sent it already. There were a lot of attachments, so check your Junk Mailbox in case it ended up in there. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-04-17 11:02 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Hi Amani, Yes, send what you have to kresch831 at mchsi.com and I'll add them to our chat pieces and resend the whole "dossier" as an attachment to the chat line. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: Amani Oakley To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, 04 Nov 2017 10:13:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol I will email you directly with a bunch of other articles I have compiled, including the original scientific publication which appears to have started the whole hysteria regarding liver failure in cats being caused by Winstrol. I have highlighted and notated the study so you can see how very poorly designed the study is, and the serious flaws with their logic and conclusions. I don?t think I can post attachments to this chatline. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-03-17 10:56 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol Dear Kitty Friends, I've attached a number of exchanges regarding the use of Winstrol to combat FeLV. I;m taking my compilation to my vet and telling her (well firmly asking) to read through the information and begin to do her own research. Our vets need to do at least two pieces of research/investigation. First, they need to research the efficacy of using steroids on cats and secondly, they need to find legal supply routes to obtain Winstrol/Stargate. If I've missed any significant parts of our exchanges, please tell me and resend those parts. I'll add them to what we have and it will all be in one place. Thanks to all of you for weighing in on this critical subject _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From felinerescue at frontier.com Fri Nov 3 10:08:55 2017 From: felinerescue at frontier.com (Lorrie) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 11:08:55 -0400 Subject: [Felvtalk] Redundant posts, an experiment In-Reply-To: <48335b48.10f45e.15f7eaea0f7.Webtop.50@optonline.net> References: <48335b48.10f45e.15f7eaea0f7.Webtop.50@optonline.net> Message-ID: <20171103150854.GA794@lnx12.netgear.com> Bob, I also use reply but then I delete the redundant posts, and they never come back. I don't understand why they are coming back in your posts. Perhaps this is because I use a very powerful, text operating system - LINUX, not Microsoft. Lorrie On 11-02, ROBERT CHAPEL wrote: > After imploring all of you to delete redundant posts before posting your > notes to the group, I noticed that my last two posts ( where I DID this) > STILL had all the redundant posts included in the post.....?? > > I tend to use REPLY all when responding...and, in turn, seeing my post > twice.? This time I am deleting ALL other posts and simply hitting > reply...?? If it posts to the group with all the other redundant posts > I'll have to ask the advice of the list owner to see if there is an > answer.... perhaps it does not bother others as much as it bothers me to > have to sift through 20 other messages for the new ones.... so, after > this I'll desist? : ) From felinerescue at frontier.com Sat Nov 4 17:01:00 2017 From: felinerescue at frontier.com (Lorrie) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 18:01:00 -0400 Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol In-Reply-To: <1935531886.437521915.1509807731943.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> References: <1935531886.437521915.1509807731943.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <20171104220059.GA1257@lnx12.netgear.com> I'm not on the chat line. Can this be sent to my personal e-mail as a pdf file? felinerescue at frontier.com Lorrie On 11-04, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: > Hi Amani, > Yes, send what you have to kresch831 at mchsi.com and I'll add them to our chat pieces and resend the whole "dossier" as an attachment to the chat line. > Ken > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Amani Oakley > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Sent: Sat, 04 Nov 2017 10:13:29 -0400 (EDT) > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol > > I will email you directly with a bunch of other articles I have compiled, including the original scientific publication which appears to have started the whole hysteria regarding liver failure in cats being caused by Winstrol. I have highlighted and notated the study so you can see how very poorly designed the study is, and the serious flaws with their logic and conclusions. > > I don???t think I can post attachments to this chatline. > > Amani > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com > Sent: November-03-17 10:56 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: [Felvtalk] Compiled info on Winstrol > > Dear Kitty Friends, > I've attached a number of exchanges regarding the use of Winstrol to combat FeLV. I;m taking my compilation to my vet and telling her (well firmly asking) to read through the information and begin to do her own research. Our vets need to do at least two pieces of research/investigation. First, they need to research the efficacy of using steroids on cats and secondly, they need to find legal supply routes to obtain Winstrol/Stargate. If I've missed any significant parts of our exchanges, please tell me and resend those parts. I'll add them to what we have and it will all be in one place. Thanks to all of you for weighing in on this critical subject > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From ardyr at centurytel.net Sat Nov 4 18:28:10 2017 From: ardyr at centurytel.net (Ardy Robertson) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 18:28:10 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: References: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: <007c01d355c4$9c81a750$d584f5f0$@centurytel.net> Hi Marlene - I am so interested to hear about his treatment, very excited that they use it for FeLV treatment, how wonderful. I hope sincerely that they use it in conjunction with Doxycyclene and Prednisolone. I personally used the liquid form of Winstrol (it's other name here is Stanizolol I think - is this correct Amani?). But I believe Amani used the pills. The reason I went with oral liquid form is because Tigger took liquid easier than pills and it came in "his favorite" salmon flavor! Best of luck to you with the treatment of your little friend. Ardy -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of marlene melpignano Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 5:04 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Dear all, Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. Thanks all for your support. Best M&M Inviato da iPhone > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... >> >> Thanks for your help >> Marl?ne >> >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From ardyr at centurytel.net Sat Nov 4 18:33:50 2017 From: ardyr at centurytel.net (Ardy Robertson) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 18:33:50 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: <727209949.431446468.1509632328992.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> References: <346607319.431445473.1509632305587.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> <727209949.431446468.1509632328992.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <008201d355c5$6acb8f40$4062adc0$@centurytel.net> Bless you Ken for doing this - I agree. It was very heartening to hear that they are using it in Italy!! -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 9:19 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Good Morningh all-- I've been following the posts to Marlene and others regarding Winstrol/Stargate. I began following when my feral-turned-wonderful-domestic Tuxedo, Zorro, became ill with FeLV. We tried the Prednisolone route and he perked up for a week or so but then just slept more and more as his red count bottomed out. I laid next to him as he died and shared that with all of you at that time. What I'm writing about now is what we must do for future cats that may contract FeLV. I have printed the pertinent information that began with Amani and then others regarding Winstrol and Stargate minus any links and email addresses. I am taking this info to my Vet and telling her to start her research immediately. I will also tell her she could be the first Vet in our area to truly treat our kitties with a drug that works. If we all present the information we've been sharing we will begin a ground-swell of interest and hope. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: dlgegg at windstream.net To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Thu, 02 Nov 2017 09:21:32 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Prayers for you and your baby. ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? > I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > > > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > > > Ardy > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > >> Dear All, > >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > >> > >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > >> > >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > >> > >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > >> > >> Thanks for your help > >> Marl?ne > >> > >> > >> Inviato da iPhone > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Felvtalk mailing list > > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From ardyr at centurytel.net Sat Nov 4 18:37:25 2017 From: ardyr at centurytel.net (Ardy Robertson) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: References: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: <008301d355c5$f1f30430$d5d90c90$@centurytel.net> I totally agree - and as I said, I just hope they are also using it with Doxy and Prednisolone ........ I am very interested in their results. Do we have any way of finding out? Thanks, Ardy -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Amani Oakley Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 9:22 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Marlene, I should really say that I have never used the injectable form but it is injected intramuscularly and doesn?t last very long, and will be far less convenient to give than the pills. As I mentioned in a previous response, the effect on the liver appears to be transitory and fades after the Winstrol is discontinued. You might consider an initial intramuscular injection by your vet, to give a quick boost to baseline, and then continuing with daily pills. I am also THRILLED to hear that Winstrol is used regularly in Itally for FeLV. Finally, SOMEWHERE that is using a medication that actually shows some promise against this hideous virus, and doesn?t appear to be swayed by the highly irrelevant athletic doping scandals! Good luck Marlene and keep us posted. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of marlene melpignano Sent: November-02-17 6:04 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Dear all, Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. Thanks all for your support. Best M&M Inviato da iPhone > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... >> >> Thanks for your help >> Marl?ne >> >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From ardyr at centurytel.net Sat Nov 4 18:43:09 2017 From: ardyr at centurytel.net (Ardy Robertson) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2017 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: References: <346607319.431445473.1509632305587.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> <727209949.431446468.1509632328992.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <008901d355c6$c2009520$4601bf60$@centurytel.net> Amani - you must have been irate when they said well maybe it wasn't FeLV in the first place -- after they repeatedly told you to put Zander down.........ardy -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Amani Oakley Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 10:04 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Hi Ken I couldn?t agree with you more, but I fear that the scientific/medical evidence is thin because of the really stupid study done a decade ago, which gave three cats massive doses of Winstrol (same levels as given to sled dogs) and reported the resulting elevation of liver enzymes. And then, of course, there is the unhelpful connection to the athletic doping scandals. Studies looking into the effects of Winstrol are therefore few and far between (though I have found a few). Moreover, a physician friend of mine explained to me that once a drug is off-patent (as Winstrol is) then the drug companies can make very little money from it, and so they will not spend money to set up clinical trials, and will instead push other related drugs that are still covered by a patent, so they make more money on the sale of those other drugs. The problem is that, as far as I can determine to date, though there are lots of anabolic steroids, Winstrol is the only one that seems to have this effect on bone marrow to cause it to grow, create new cells, regenerate, etc, which in turn causes the production of red cells, white cells and platelets from the activated bone marrow. In addition, Winstrol is considered to have very mild side effects in comparison to other anabolic steroids. Winstrol is also found to be very quickly effective. Most of those athletes who will speak about steroid use, confirm that Winstrol is one of the most effective and safest of the drugs (and remember that athletes who are using steroids use them at hundreds if not thousands of times the recommended doses, and they "stack" them will all sorts of other steroids). I also found, with my own vets, that even with solid proof in front of their own eyes (with cats condemned to death, showing an amazing recovery), they will often look for other explanations other than that it was the Winstrol. As I mentioned with my little Zander, after being told by every vet I spoke with that there was nothing I could do and Zander was going to die (and best to put him down immediately), and being able to show serial blood results weekly which showed a clear improvement from critical haematology values to normal results, at the end of it all, I start hearing things like, "well maybe it was never FeLV in the first place". I agree that the way to start turning this around, for all of us who have had good results or who may have a cat in the unenviable situation of having little or no other options, is to speak with our vets about Winstrol. As I have mentioned in previous posts, I have now used Winstrol, usually in combination with at least the prednisone (with the doxycycline being added on in circumstances involving something likely infectious), for a range of cat problems and have had excellent results every time but once. One case was a 16 year old cat with a nasal sarcoma (kept the sarcoma from causing severe facial swelling, and kept my cat eating for another two years); one case was a cat who came from a feral colony which I later found out had had FIV rampaging through it and killing all the cats (and she came to me EXTREMELY ill with a sky-high fever, tympanic abdomen and fluid around her lungs - she survived when I thought there was no hope at all, and she's still with me now); I have used it to avoid knee surgery for Zander when he pulled his cruciate ligament; and am I currently using it now to treat a spinal lesion in Pippin - a three-year old who gets flair-ups of neurological problems which I tracked to a spinal lesion, and when the lesion causes swelling, etc., the symptoms reappear. The combination of prednisone and Winstrol appears to be the only thing that reverses the effects of the lesion. I think the Winstrol is seriously underutilized and cats respond very well to it, in a number of circumstances. Obviously, it is not a cure-all, and we've heard from other folks who've tried it and gotten no appreciable results, so I am not suggesting it is a panacea by any means. Further, I understand that FeLV is now thought to be caused by at least four or five different types or strains of virus, and I believe that this is the reason that some people get amazing results and some people see nothing. Hopefully, Marlene will get a good response, and it is very heartening to hear that in Italy, the drug is commonly used to treat FeLV cats. It was commonly used in North America as well, in the '80's and '90's, until the stupid doping scandals (especially Ben Johnson's Olympic gold medal being stripped) shone an ugly spotlight on it. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-02-17 10:19 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Good Morningh all-- I've been following the posts to Marlene and others regarding Winstrol/Stargate. I began following when my feral-turned-wonderful-domestic Tuxedo, Zorro, became ill with FeLV. We tried the Prednisolone route and he perked up for a week or so but then just slept more and more as his red count bottomed out. I laid next to him as he died and shared that with all of you at that time. What I'm writing about now is what we must do for future cats that may contract FeLV. I have printed the pertinent information that began with Amani and then others regarding Winstrol and Stargate minus any links and email addresses. I am taking this info to my Vet and telling her to start her research immediately. I will also tell her she could be the first Vet in our area to truly treat our kitties with a drug that works. If we all present the information we've been sharing we will begin a ground-swell of interest and hope. Ken ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? > I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > > > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > > > Ardy > > > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > >> Dear All, > >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > >> > >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > >> > >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > >> > >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > >> > >> Thanks for your help > >> Marl?ne _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Mon Nov 6 02:05:55 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 08:05:55 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: <008901d355c6$c2009520$4601bf60$@centurytel.net> References: <346607319.431445473.1509632305587.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> <727209949.431446468.1509632328992.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> <008901d355c6$c2009520$4601bf60$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Totally irate. It was just so clear that they weren't prepared to look at Winstrol in a new light - even with me holding a stack of serial weekly lab results in my hand. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Ardy Robertson Sent: November-04-17 7:43 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Amani - you must have been irate when they said well maybe it wasn't FeLV in the first place -- after they repeatedly told you to put Zander down.........ardy -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Amani Oakley Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 10:04 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Hi Ken I couldn?t agree with you more, but I fear that the scientific/medical evidence is thin because of the really stupid study done a decade ago, which gave three cats massive doses of Winstrol (same levels as given to sled dogs) and reported the resulting elevation of liver enzymes. And then, of course, there is the unhelpful connection to the athletic doping scandals. Studies looking into the effects of Winstrol are therefore few and far between (though I have found a few). Moreover, a physician friend of mine explained to me that once a drug is off-patent (as Winstrol is) then the drug companies can make very little money from it, and so they will not spend money to set up clinical trials, and will instead push other related drugs that are still covered by a patent, so they make more money on the sale of those other drugs. The problem is that, as far as I can determine to date, though there are lots of anabolic steroids, Winstrol is the only one that seems to have this effect on bone marrow to cause it to grow, create new cells, regenerate, etc, which in turn causes the production of red cells, white cells and platelets from the activated bone marrow. In addition, Winstrol is considered to have very mild side effects in comparison to other anabolic steroids. Winstrol is also found to be very quickly effective. Most of those athletes who will speak about steroid use, confirm that Winstrol is one of the most effective and safest of the drugs (and remember that athletes who are using steroids use them at hundreds if not thousands of times the recommended doses, and they "stack" them will all sorts of other steroids). I also found, with my own vets, that even with solid proof in front of their own eyes (with cats condemned to death, showing an amazing recovery), they will often look for other explanations other than that it was the Winstrol. As I mentioned with my little Zander, after being told by every vet I spoke with that there was nothing I could do and Zander was going to die (and best to put him down immediately), and being able to show serial blood results weekly which showed a clear improvement from critical haematology values to normal results, at the end of it all, I start hearing things like, "well maybe it was never FeLV in the first place". I agree that the way to start turning this around, for all of us who have had good results or who may have a cat in the unenviable situation of having little or no other options, is to speak with our vets about Winstrol. As I have mentioned in previous posts, I have now used Winstrol, usually in combination with at least the prednisone (with the doxycycline being added on in circumstances involving something likely infectious), for a range of cat problems and have had excellent results every time but once. One case was a 16 year old cat with a nasal sarcoma (kept the sarcoma from causing severe facial swelling, and kept my cat eating for another two years); one case was a cat who came from a feral colony which I later found out had had FIV rampaging through it and killing all the cats (and she came to me EXTREMELY ill with a sky-high fever, tympanic abdomen and fluid around her lungs - she survived when I thought there was no hope at all, and she's still with me now); I have used it to avoid knee surgery for Zander when he pulled his cruciate ligament; and am I currently using it now to treat a spinal lesion in Pippin - a three-year old who gets flair-ups of neurological problems which I tracked to a spinal lesion, and when the lesion causes swelling, etc., the symptoms reappear. The combination of prednisone and Winstrol appears to be the only thing that reverses the effects of the lesion. I think the Winstrol is seriously underutilized and cats respond very well to it, in a number of circumstances. Obviously, it is not a cure-all, and we've heard from other folks who've tried it and gotten no appreciable results, so I am not suggesting it is a panacea by any means. Further, I understand that FeLV is now thought to be caused by at least four or five different types or strains of virus, and I believe that this is the reason that some people get amazing results and some people see nothing. Hopefully, Marlene will get a good response, and it is very heartening to hear that in Italy, the drug is commonly used to treat FeLV cats. It was commonly used in North America as well, in the '80's and '90's, until the stupid doping scandals (especially Ben Johnson's Olympic gold medal being stripped) shone an ugly spotlight on it. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com Sent: November-02-17 10:19 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Good Morningh all-- I've been following the posts to Marlene and others regarding Winstrol/Stargate. I began following when my feral-turned-wonderful-domestic Tuxedo, Zorro, became ill with FeLV. We tried the Prednisolone route and he perked up for a week or so but then just slept more and more as his red count bottomed out. I laid next to him as he died and shared that with all of you at that time. What I'm writing about now is what we must do for future cats that may contract FeLV. I have printed the pertinent information that began with Amani and then others regarding Winstrol and Stargate minus any links and email addresses. I am taking this info to my Vet and telling her to start her research immediately. I will also tell her she could be the first Vet in our area to truly treat our kitties with a drug that works. If we all present the information we've been sharing we will begin a ground-swell of interest and hope. Ken ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > Dear all, > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. > What is better, pills or injections? > I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > Thanks all for your support. > Best > M&M > > Inviato da iPhone > > > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > > > Ardy > > > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > >> Dear All, > >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > >> > >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > >> > >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > >> > >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > >> > >> Thanks for your help > >> Marl?ne _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Mon Nov 6 02:06:38 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 08:06:38 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: <007c01d355c4$9c81a750$d584f5f0$@centurytel.net> References: <20171101144719.9GPW0.18774.root@pamxwww01-z01> <000001d35393$1add3940$5097abc0$@centurytel.net> <007c01d355c4$9c81a750$d584f5f0$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: Close Ardy - Stanozolol. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Ardy Robertson Sent: November-04-17 7:28 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Hi Marlene - I am so interested to hear about his treatment, very excited that they use it for FeLV treatment, how wonderful. I hope sincerely that they use it in conjunction with Doxycyclene and Prednisolone. I personally used the liquid form of Winstrol (it's other name here is Stanizolol I think - is this correct Amani?). But I believe Amani used the pills. The reason I went with oral liquid form is because Tigger took liquid easier than pills and it came in "his favorite" salmon flavor! Best of luck to you with the treatment of your little friend. Ardy -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of marlene melpignano Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 5:04 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help Dear all, Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. What is better, pills or injections? I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. Thanks all for your support. Best M&M Inviato da iPhone > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of dlgegg at windstream.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2017 1:47 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Don't apologize for questions, that is one way we learn. I have had no problems, but am sure Amani and others do have answers for you > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: >> Dear All, >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. >> >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? >> >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. >> >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... >> >> Thanks for your help >> Marl?ne >> >> >> Inviato da iPhone > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From kathstix at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 07:57:13 2017 From: kathstix at gmail.com (Katherine K.) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 08:57:13 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Grieving for K Message-ID: Hi everyone, I lost my perfect little tuxedo soulmate last week. He was my first cat and the best friend ever. At age 11 we discovered he was FeLV+, likely contracted from some kittens we were fostering at the time. We lost all kittens within a year, went on to foster another FeLV kitty, Jazz, for a year before we lost him to the virus too. Krammer hung in there for 4 more years with this stupid virus, through many ups and downs. We loved each other dearly and I believe that is what kept him going until the ripe old age of 15. His nose tumor had grown all year. It distorted his face, leaked fluid and required several daily cleanings for the last few months. He had declined a lot and was down to 6.5 pounds at the end, but was still eating and using the bathroom normally. A week ago I discovered his tumor was beginning to affect the roof of his mouth and I didn't want to wait until it ruptured there. That would have caused him unnecessary suffering. We made the difficult decision to take him to the vet. I picked up his ashes on Friday and they are keeping me company, as well as plenty of cuddles from my other (non FeLV) kitty. Thanks to everyone for the support over the years. Here is what I shared on my Facebook page about Krammer last week: Today I had to say a terribly hard goodbye to my best little buddy Krammer. Last December, I noticed he had a slightly bloody nose. It turned out to be a nasal tumor, and he fought the cancer for nearly a year. He was 15 years old. Krammer was a Craigslist kitty. We picked him up one Friday after work in 2005 from a Seinfeld fan who didn?t know how to spell Kramer. The funny name stuck, and produced many, many nicknames. Sweet Krammie, I?ll miss your perfectly pink nose and toes. I?ll miss the way you begged to be picked up and put in the warm dryer after I finished folding all the clothes. You?d settle down and purr. I?ll miss your adorable nose wrinkle that appeared when you?d ferociously bite Mr. Squirrel during playtime, and the way your neck smelled faintly like maple syrup. I?ll miss laughing about your weird obsession with licking the blinds and laying on crinkly paper. I?ll miss how you would come running whenever we whistled ?Morning? from Peer Gynt. That became your theme song. I?ll miss your ridiculous call-of-the-wild yowl whenever Lady Bird wouldn?t play with you, even the ones that woke me up in the middle of the night. I?ll miss how every night you would come walking up the side of the bed, purring and giving out head bumps, and paw at the blanket for me to let you under the covers. You?d crawl in, turn around, and settle down for the night. Though you were never a lap cat, these cuddles more than made up for it. I?ll miss playing chase with you on my lunch breaks. You were so excited to see me, you?d race through the house, begging for me to catch you and give you a big hug. I?ll miss dressing you up in silly outfits, which you mostly just purred through. Since it?s Halloween, I hope you won?t mind if I share a few with your fans. I?m grateful to everyone who enjoyed and appreciated his photos over the years. He was a delightful subject to photograph. Once during a photoshoot of my dad?s jewelry, he walked over and sat down in the middle, giving me a look like, ?Ok, mom, I?m ready for my close up.? Over the last year, he really enjoyed going out on his harness and leash to chase bugs and lay in the sun. He was so curious, he enjoyed exploring new places, and I?ll always regret that we never got to take him camping. He was a friend to so many foster kittens and didn?t even mind the dogs he met. A truly wonderful little being. I?ll miss you, sweet one. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From merrykatmeows at email.com Mon Nov 6 10:27:12 2017 From: merrykatmeows at email.com (kat) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 17:27:12 +0100 Subject: [Felvtalk] Grieving for K In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From j13w0lson at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 10:35:37 2017 From: j13w0lson at gmail.com (Jennifer Olson) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 10:35:37 -0600 Subject: [Felvtalk] Krammer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Kat, you are an amazing fur-baby Mama ! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dlgegg at windstream.net Mon Nov 6 10:50:22 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 10:50:22 -0600 Subject: [Felvtalk] Grieving for K In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20171106115022.APZS6.11791.root@pamxwww10-z01> Dear, sweet Krammer, you lived and loved well, time for your reward. ---- kat wrote: > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From dlgegg at windstream.net Mon Nov 6 10:54:29 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 10:54:29 -0600 Subject: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20171106115429.UG45K.11800.root@pamxwww10-z01> Times like this I would like to be able to just slug them without suffering the consequences. Maybe they should get their ears washed out and their minds opened up. ---- Amani Oakley wrote: > Totally irate. It was just so clear that they weren't prepared to look at Winstrol in a new light - even with me holding a stack of serial weekly lab results in my hand. > > Amani > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Ardy Robertson > Sent: November-04-17 7:43 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Amani - you must have been irate when they said well maybe it wasn't FeLV in the first place -- after they repeatedly told you to put Zander down.........ardy > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Amani Oakley > Sent: Thursday, November 2, 2017 10:04 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Hi Ken > > I couldn?t agree with you more, but I fear that the scientific/medical evidence is thin because of the really stupid study done a decade ago, which gave three cats massive doses of Winstrol (same levels as given to sled dogs) and reported the resulting elevation of liver enzymes. And then, of course, there is the unhelpful connection to the athletic doping scandals. Studies looking into the effects of Winstrol are therefore few and far between (though I have found a few). Moreover, a physician friend of mine explained to me that once a drug is off-patent (as Winstrol is) then the drug companies can make very little money from it, and so they will not spend money to set up clinical trials, and will instead push other related drugs that are still covered by a patent, so they make more money on the sale of those other drugs. > > The problem is that, as far as I can determine to date, though there are lots of anabolic steroids, Winstrol is the only one that seems to have this effect on bone marrow to cause it to grow, create new cells, regenerate, etc, which in turn causes the production of red cells, white cells and platelets from the activated bone marrow. In addition, Winstrol is considered to have very mild side effects in comparison to other anabolic steroids. Winstrol is also found to be very quickly effective. Most of those athletes who will speak about steroid use, confirm that Winstrol is one of the most effective and safest of the drugs (and remember that athletes who are using steroids use them at hundreds if not thousands of times the recommended doses, and they "stack" them will all sorts of other steroids). > > I also found, with my own vets, that even with solid proof in front of their own eyes (with cats condemned to death, showing an amazing recovery), they will often look for other explanations other than that it was the Winstrol. As I mentioned with my little Zander, after being told by every vet I spoke with that there was nothing I could do and Zander was going to die (and best to put him down immediately), and being able to show serial blood results weekly which showed a clear improvement from critical haematology values to normal results, at the end of it all, I start hearing things like, "well maybe it was never FeLV in the first place". > > I agree that the way to start turning this around, for all of us who have had good results or who may have a cat in the unenviable situation of having little or no other options, is to speak with our vets about Winstrol. As I have mentioned in previous posts, I have now used Winstrol, usually in combination with at least the prednisone (with the doxycycline being added on in circumstances involving something likely infectious), for a range of cat problems and have had excellent results every time but once. One case was a 16 year old cat with a nasal sarcoma (kept the sarcoma from causing severe facial swelling, and kept my cat eating for another two years); one case was a cat who came from a feral colony which I later found out had had FIV rampaging through it and killing all the cats (and she came to me EXTREMELY ill with a sky-high fever, tympanic abdomen and fluid around her lungs - she survived when I thought there was no hope at all, and she's still with me now); I have used it to avoid knee surgery for Zander when he pulled his cruciate ligament; and am I currently using it now to treat a spinal lesion in Pippin - a three-year old who gets flair-ups of neurological problems which I tracked to a spinal lesion, and when the lesion causes swelling, etc., the symptoms reappear. The combination of prednisone and Winstrol appears to be the only thing that reverses the effects of the lesion. > > I think the Winstrol is seriously underutilized and cats respond very well to it, in a number of circumstances. Obviously, it is not a cure-all, and we've heard from other folks who've tried it and gotten no appreciable results, so I am not suggesting it is a panacea by any means. Further, I understand that FeLV is now thought to be caused by at least four or five different types or strains of virus, and I believe that this is the reason that some people get amazing results and some people see nothing. > > Hopefully, Marlene will get a good response, and it is very heartening to hear that in Italy, the drug is commonly used to treat FeLV cats. It was commonly used in North America as well, in the '80's and '90's, until the stupid doping scandals (especially Ben Johnson's Olympic gold medal being stripped) shone an ugly spotlight on it. > > Amani > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of kresch831 at mchsi.com > Sent: November-02-17 10:19 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Immunoregolin or Lymphocyte T-cell immunomodulator - help > > Good Morningh all-- > I've been following the posts to Marlene and others regarding Winstrol/Stargate. I began following when my feral-turned-wonderful-domestic Tuxedo, Zorro, became ill with FeLV. We tried the Prednisolone route and he perked up for a week or so but then just slept more and more as his red count bottomed out. I laid next to him as he died and shared that with all of you at that time. What I'm writing about now is what we must do for future cats that may contract FeLV. I have printed the pertinent information that began with Amani and then others regarding Winstrol and Stargate minus any links and email addresses. I am taking this info to my Vet and telling her to start her research immediately. I will also tell her she could be the first Vet in our area to truly treat our kitties with a drug that works. If we all present the information we've been sharing we will begin a ground-swell of interest and hope. > Ken > > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > > Dear all, > > Good news: Winstrol is legal in Italy for animals and is called stargate. I found a pharmacist who can send it to me in Belgium or I will go to Rome myself on Saturday, he also said it is highly used in Italy for felv cats. > > What is better, pills or injections? > > I thought of pills to cause less stress, but I read it may be more toxic for the liver compared to the injectable one . > > I am also bringing the cat to a French specialised clinic this afternoon just to get a better opinion than the Belgian one. > > > > Thanks all for your support. > > Best > > M&M > > > > Inviato da iPhone > > > > > Il giorno 02 nov 2017, alle ore 05:28, Ardy Robertson ha scritto: > > > > > > Marlene - My Tigger had an active leukemia when I began Winstrol, based on his bloodwork..... and he also was not eating. I gave him an appetite stimulant called Mirtazapine, only a half of a 7.5 mg tablet, every 3rd day, and that boosted his appetite. I also fed him the canned cat food that they sell for after surgeries - it is very calorie dense but I don't remember the name of it. Sometimes I had to clip a towel around him and syringe feed him a little. I did not want to do that because he didn't like having me do that, but I made up my mind that if was going to make it, he had to have some food in him. I believe Amani knows the name of another good appetite stimulant. When he would not drink any water, I gave him clam juice (we called it his kitty cocktail)- he loved it. It is just shameful that Winstrol is not legal for this use - they hold a grudge against it because of the misuse of it by a few athletes. So our kitties have to suffer without the one thing that can help them. It is also important to combine it with the Prednisolone and the Doxycyclene because the Doxy has some property whereby it prevents the virus from replicating. Best of luck with his treatment!! > > > > > > Ardy > > > > > > ---- marlene melpignano wrote: > > >> Dear All, > > >> Unfortunately last FNA of my cat showed that he has either a lymphoma or a leukemia (in Belgium they are so bad that they cannot even have a conclusive result). > > >> My vet in Italy thinks I have to bring him to a university clinic to have a bone marrow exam, in order to decide whether a chemotherapy is worth while. > > >> > > >> Have you had any experience with lymphoma or leukemia in Felv cats? Have you treated them or would be desperate and painful for the cat? > > >> > > >> About Winstrol, the two vets were not against it, but it is illegal in Europe and they would give me something similar in case I decide not to go for chemotherapy. However, they would like to know whether your cats had already a lymphoma or leukemia when you used it or were just Felv + and also whether they had infections going on; otherwise they doubt about using doxycycline. > > >> > > >> Sorry for all the questions, but I am afraid there is not much to be done, and if I want to make it a last try I have to be fast. As of today he is not eating ... > > >> > > >> Thanks for your help > > >> Marl?ne > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Mon Nov 6 11:48:20 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 17:48:20 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Grieving for K In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Katherine The pain in your heart is so clear for everyone to see. I am so very sorry for the wrenching loss you suffered with the loss of Krammer, and also for the terrible loss of one kitten after another and then Jazz as well. There is just nothing that will soothe the soul-searing loss, except for the passage of time and the knowledge that you gave these deserving little angels, a lot of love, warmth and comfort, which they clearly wouldn?t have had without your exceptional kindness. Keep that thought close as you mourn the loss of Krammer. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Katherine K. Sent: November-06-17 8:57 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Grieving for K Hi everyone, I lost my perfect little tuxedo soulmate last week. He was my first cat and the best friend ever. At age 11 we discovered he was FeLV+, likely contracted from some kittens we were fostering at the time. We lost all kittens within a year, went on to foster another FeLV kitty, Jazz, for a year before we lost him to the virus too. Krammer hung in there for 4 more years with this stupid virus, through many ups and downs. We loved each other dearly and I believe that is what kept him going until the ripe old age of 15. His nose tumor had grown all year. It distorted his face, leaked fluid and required several daily cleanings for the last few months. He had declined a lot and was down to 6.5 pounds at the end, but was still eating and using the bathroom normally. A week ago I discovered his tumor was beginning to affect the roof of his mouth and I didn't want to wait until it ruptured there. That would have caused him unnecessary suffering. We made the difficult decision to take him to the vet. I picked up his ashes on Friday and they are keeping me company, as well as plenty of cuddles from my other (non FeLV) kitty. Thanks to everyone for the support over the years. Here is what I shared on my Facebook page about Krammer last week: Today I had to say a terribly hard goodbye to my best little buddy Krammer. Last December, I noticed he had a slightly bloody nose. It turned out to be a nasal tumor, and he fought the cancer for nearly a year. He was 15 years old. Krammer was a Craigslist kitty. We picked him up one Friday after work in 2005 from a Seinfeld fan who didn?t know how to spell Kramer. The funny name stuck, and produced many, many nicknames. Sweet Krammie, I?ll miss your perfectly pink nose and toes. I?ll miss the way you begged to be picked up and put in the warm dryer after I finished folding all the clothes. You?d settle down and purr. I?ll miss your adorable nose wrinkle that appeared when you?d ferociously bite Mr. Squirrel during playtime, and the way your neck smelled faintly like maple syrup. I?ll miss laughing about your weird obsession with licking the blinds and laying on crinkly paper. I?ll miss how you would come running whenever we whistled ?Morning? from Peer Gynt. That became your theme song. I?ll miss your ridiculous call-of-the-wild yowl whenever Lady Bird wouldn?t play with you, even the ones that woke me up in the middle of the night. I?ll miss how every night you would come walking up the side of the bed, purring and giving out head bumps, and paw at the blanket for me to let you under the covers. You?d crawl in, turn around, and settle down for the night. Though you were never a lap cat, these cuddles more than made up for it. I?ll miss playing chase with you on my lunch breaks. You were so excited to see me, you?d race through the house, begging for me to catch you and give you a big hug. I?ll miss dressing you up in silly outfits, which you mostly just purred through. Since it?s Halloween, I hope you won?t mind if I share a few with your fans. I?m grateful to everyone who enjoyed and appreciated his photos over the years. He was a delightful subject to photograph. Once during a photoshoot of my dad?s jewelry, he walked over and sat down in the middle, giving me a look like, ?Ok, mom, I?m ready for my close up.? Over the last year, he really enjoyed going out on his harness and leash to chase bugs and lay in the sun. He was so curious, he enjoyed exploring new places, and I?ll always regret that we never got to take him camping. He was a friend to so many foster kittens and didn?t even mind the dogs he met. A truly wonderful little being. I?ll miss you, sweet one. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From thyme2sail at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 13:31:47 2017 From: thyme2sail at gmail.com (Pam Doore) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 14:31:47 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Grieving for K In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Katherine, My deepest condolences on the loss of your soul-mate! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bchapel at optonline.net Mon Nov 6 15:39:38 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2017 16:39:38 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Felvtalk] Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 14 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5aa41ad9.1132ee.15f93464a23.Webtop.59@optonline.net> Katherine.... I'm so sorry that you had to say goodby to this adorable little being... .. your "eulogy" had me in tears... but by the time I finished it I felt that _ I _? had known him as well....? I'm so glad you had as many years together as you did... and for your kindness in looking after so many Felv kitties whose luck was that much less even than Krammers....? Their good luck was in finding a home with you.... BOb From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 22 09:14:29 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question Message-ID: I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. Sent from my iPad From kresch831 at mchsi.com Wed Nov 22 10:03:20 2017 From: kresch831 at mchsi.com (kresch831 at mchsi.com) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 11:03:20 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <99296836.478915215.1511366600940.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. ----- Original Message ----- From: Theresa O'Rourke To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Felvtalk] Question I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From marlmel at hotmail.com Wed Nov 22 10:30:44 2017 From: marlmel at hotmail.com (marlene melpignano) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:30:44 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: <99296836.478915215.1511366600940.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> References: <99296836.478915215.1511366600940.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: From what I read (scientific articles) the virus might stay in the room from 2 to 7 days. No conclusive data on this, but be careful. Even if a bite is surely the most common way to catch Felv Inviato da iPhone > Il giorno 22 nov 2017, alle ore 17:03, kresch831 at mchsi.com ha scritto: > > My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Theresa O'Rourke > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) > Subject: [Felvtalk] Question > > I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. > My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch > The disease. > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Wed Nov 22 13:04:51 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:04:51 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. Amani -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Question I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 22 13:17:05 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:17:05 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you! Sent from my iPad > On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: > > My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Theresa O'Rourke > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) > Subject: [Felvtalk] Question > > I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. > My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch > The disease. > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 22 13:17:41 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:17:41 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: <99296836.478915215.1511366600940.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <57F6E0C9-06E3-430D-B5EC-FA8EC10F116C@videotron.ca> Thank you! Sent from my iPad > On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:30 AM, marlene melpignano wrote: > > From what I read (scientific articles) the virus might stay in the room from 2 to 7 days. No conclusive data on this, but be careful. Even if a bite is surely the most common way to catch Felv > > Inviato da iPhone > >> Il giorno 22 nov 2017, alle ore 17:03, kresch831 at mchsi.com ha scritto: >> >> My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Theresa O'Rourke >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch >> The disease. >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 22 13:19:55 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:19:55 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <12335F70-455C-490A-849A-8BADF0A69BCC@videotron.ca> Thank you! Sent from my iPad > On Nov 22, 2017, at 2:04 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: > > We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. > > Amani > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke > Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: [Felvtalk] Question > > I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. > My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From veery at bellsouth.net Wed Nov 22 13:28:57 2017 From: veery at bellsouth.net (Shelley Theye) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:28:57 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: <99296836.478915215.1511366600940.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> References: <99296836.478915215.1511366600940.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of time. The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat leaves should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, etc. from water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on you?but that might be going overboard. Definitely wash hands after handling... Shelley > On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: > > My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Theresa O'Rourke > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) > Subject: [Felvtalk] Question > > I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. > My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch > The disease. > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aoakley at oakleylegal.com Wed Nov 22 13:35:20 2017 From: aoakley at oakleylegal.com (Amani Oakley) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:35:20 +0000 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: <99296836.478915215.1511366600940.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: As I said ? I had a cat in with at least 8 other cats for 7 years with no transmission. They shared food and water bowls, beds, grooming, playing, biting, scratching - the whole nine yards. I don?t think it is particularly contagious with older cats. Amani From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Shelley Theye Sent: November-22-17 2:29 PM To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of time. The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat leaves should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, etc. from water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on you?but that might be going overboard. Definitely wash hands after handling... Shelley On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. ----- Original Message ----- From: Theresa O'Rourke > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Felvtalk] Question I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gloriajhook at verizon.net Wed Nov 22 14:47:55 2017 From: gloriajhook at verizon.net (Gloria) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 12:47:55 -0800 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <84D3EC5C-F72E-4FF9-8F61-75D7CFCEC4FE@verizon.net> Immune system plays a huge part-usually mature cats have a vibrant immune system, it?s the very young or older cats that would be more at risk, IMO. Also, the FeLV cat?s immune system is compromised, I believe, so contact with other cats would be something to consider for the health of the FeLV diagnosed cat. I have a cat diagnosed in 2010, that I strongly feel beat the virus-(answer to Prayer) he was older when I found him, the vet guessing him to be around 1 year old. We keep him in our guest room with a modified door so he ?participates? in the hall/house activities and the room is ventilated. I will not take him to the vet unless he becomes ill-keeping the STRESS down so no testing! My practice is to wash my hands with alcohol and or soap for 20 seconds before & after I?m in his room. I keep his dishes sterile, no shared food or water or containers- but that?s about it. Now- this is my practice and everyone needs to follow his/her own inner voice on this matter- just sharing - not pushing an agenda. lol Gloria, furmommy to Buddy Luv -g ?? Sent from my iPhone > On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:04 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: > > We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. > > Amani > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke > Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: [Felvtalk] Question > > I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. > My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. > > From dlgegg at windstream.net Wed Nov 22 15:19:36 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:19:36 -0600 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20171122161936.5IDUO.7499.root@pamxwww08-z01> I have had feral and dump cats for over 40 years, including 4 FELV cats. I have never had to wash anything when one of them passed. None of my FELV negative cats ever contracted the disease and all have died of old age including Annie who was FELV and over 10 years. They eat from the same bowls, sleep on the same beds. It has to do with the age of the cts. If your cts are under 1 year, they are more likely to contract the disease because their imune system is not as strong. ---- Theresa O'Rourke wrote: > I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 22 15:24:46 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:24:46 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: <99296836.478915215.1511366600940.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Message-ID: Thank you, that is one of the best answers I?ve received. I won?t do this again, because I take care of other?s cats. However, for this time, the cat will be in his own room, he?ll have special toys I?ll throw out after, I?ll play with him, and brush him, poor thing. I?ll wash my hands and change clothes, it may be fanatic, but whatever.. However, after he leaves, I?ll wash everything, and give the room and floor a big cleaning. So all should be well, I promised my daughter, But I won?t do it again. Thank you for the great answer!!! Poor cat, it is so sad. Sent from my iPad > On Nov 22, 2017, at 2:28 PM, Shelley Theye wrote: > > Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of time. > The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat leaves > should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, etc. from water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. > > You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on you?but that might be > going overboard. Definitely wash hands after handling... > > Shelley > > >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: >> >> My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Theresa O'Rourke >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch >> The disease. >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 22 15:34:40 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:34:40 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Wonderful, helpful answers, Message-ID: I am still going to give the poor kitty a lot of love while he is here, it is so sad, He was a stray someone has adopted brought to the vet! What a hard life these poor cats have. My three cats are spoiled ????? Sent from my iPad From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 22 17:25:25 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:25:25 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Grieving for K Message-ID: <6FBF453D-B988-4FA9-99B7-A50C6E42129D@videotron.ca> So sorry for your loss! But I can tell your cat was well loved, had a wonderful life, thanks to you. I wish all owners treated their pets the way yo treated Krammer. Sent from my iPad From kresch831 at mchsi.com Wed Nov 22 18:26:51 2017 From: kresch831 at mchsi.com (kresch831 at mchsi.com) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:26:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Felvtalk] Wonderful, helpful answers, In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <455006256.480124504.1511396811079.JavaMail.zimbra@mchsi.com> Loving cats is our mission! ----- Original Message ----- From: Theresa O'Rourke To: Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 16:34:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Felvtalk] Wonderful, helpful answers, I am still going to give the poor kitty a lot of love while he is here, it is so sad, He was a stray someone has adopted brought to the vet! What a hard life these poor cats have. My three cats are spoiled ????? Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From veery at bellsouth.net Wed Nov 22 18:36:07 2017 From: veery at bellsouth.net (Shelley Theye) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:36:07 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Wonderful, helpful answers, In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi again Theresa, I am not understanding the circumstances. Was the cat left at a vet clinic? Is your daughter?s friend adopting him? If so, send the toys along with him to his home. If he seems OK health-wise, other than testing positive, he could live for years and be happy and a wonderful companion. Also, sometimes there are false positives on tests, so usually a second test if done or a different type of test, like an IFA test. I guess to clarify, for the virus to be transmitted through the cats sharing food or mutually grooming, it would be after a long period of time where the cats are in direct contact with each other. And even then, the chances are on the lower side. As Amani said, her cats have lived together for years with no transmission. I think keeping him separate since he will be with you for just the week, and doing the basic hand washing, etc like i mentioned, should suffice. I tend to be a worrier regarding germs, viruses, so am probably more cautious in general. Shelley > On Nov 22, 2017, at 4:34 PM, Theresa O'Rourke wrote: > > I am still going to give the poor kitty a lot of love while he is here, it is so sad, > He was a stray someone has adopted brought to the vet! What a hard life these poor cats have. > My three cats are spoiled > ????? > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 22 18:52:59 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:52:59 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Wonderful, helpful answers, In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <89569972-5FE1-42AE-81FB-D776A14FDFBC@videotron.ca> Yes, I am over cautious also. A real worrier, so your answers have helped me. My daughter?s boss took in this stray cat, brought him to the vet for treatment, shots etc.. The boss is going away for a week, and asked if I could keep the cat during that time. I have a cat garderie, but I never mix the cats, they have their own room. I said, ? yes, of course ? It is ? later ?that my daughter phoned to tell me he is positive for feline leukemia. My daughter said that the vet said, just don?t put him with any other cats, and he needs his own food bowls. So I agreed, but started to worry!! But your answers have definitely helped. I?ll probably be over cautious But I think that would be better! Sent from my iPad > On Nov 22, 2017, at 7:36 PM, Shelley Theye wrote: > > Hi again Theresa, > > I am not understanding the circumstances. Was the cat left at a vet clinic? > Is your daughter?s friend adopting him? If so, send the toys along with him to his home. > If he seems OK health-wise, other than testing positive, he could live for years and be happy and a wonderful companion. > Also, sometimes there are false positives on tests, so usually a second test if done or a different type of test, like an IFA test. > > I guess to clarify, for the virus to be transmitted through the cats sharing food or mutually grooming, > it would be after a long period of time where the cats are in direct contact with each other. > And even then, the chances are on the lower side. As Amani said, her cats have lived together for > years with no transmission. > > I think keeping him separate since he will be with you for just the week, and doing the basic hand washing, etc like i mentioned, > should suffice. I tend to be a worrier regarding germs, viruses, so am probably more cautious in general. > > Shelley > > > >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 4:34 PM, Theresa O'Rourke wrote: >> >> I am still going to give the poor kitty a lot of love while he is here, it is so sad, >> He was a stray someone has adopted brought to the vet! What a hard life these poor cats have. >> My three cats are spoiled >> ????? >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From felinerescue at frontier.com Thu Nov 23 10:56:56 2017 From: felinerescue at frontier.com (Lorrie) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 11:56:56 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20171123165655.GA1114@lnx12.netgear.com> This is my experience too. I've had FelV cats who lived to be 8 or 9 and one of my FelV cats is about 11 and still OK. These cats lived with many other negative cats. These were adult cats... I understand FelV is most dangerous to kittens whose immune systems are not fully developed. Lorrie On 11-22, Amani Oakley wrote: > We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was > infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the > infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) > That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little > boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in > the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and > groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read > repeatedly that it really isn???t that infectious, especially with > adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. > > Amani > From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 23 14:21:37 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 15:21:37 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Felvtalk] FeLV transmission In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <58df156.b8d7.15fea8afb8f.Webtop.39@optonline.net> to bolster what Amani wrote. Felv appears to be a minor risk for adult cats who did not get the disease from the queen at birth. It is a MAJOR risk for kittens born with the disease who still show it at 6 months. I wouldnt worry terribly about adults getting it from a kitten....would definitely worry abiut exposing kittens to a disease carrying adult OR kitten....also Caution with FIV adults On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 03:48 PM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: > Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to > felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Question (Theresa O'Rourke) > 2. Re: Question (Shelley Theye) > 3. Re: Question (Amani Oakley) > 4. Re: Question (Gloria) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:19:55 -0500 > From: Theresa O'Rourke To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > Message-ID: <12335F70-455C-490A-849A-8BADF0A69BCC at videotron.ca> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Thank you! > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 2:04 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy >> (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the >> house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >> repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with >> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >> >> Amani >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of Theresa O'Rourke >> Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a >> separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean >> the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of >> other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The >> disease. >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:28:57 -0500 > From: Shelley Theye To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? > contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of > time. > The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really > just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat > leaves should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, > etc. from water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. > > You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you > will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on > you?but that might be going overboard. Definitely wash hands after > handling... > > Shelley > >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: >> >> My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact >> with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted >> primarily through a bite. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Theresa O'Rourke To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a >> separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean >> the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of >> other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch >> The disease. >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:35:20 +0000 > From: Amani Oakley To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: Re: > [Felvtalk] Question > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > As I said ? I had a cat in with at least 8 other cats for 7 years with > no transmission. They shared food and water bowls, beds, grooming, > playing, biting, scratching - the whole nine yards. I don?t think it > is particularly contagious with older cats. > > Amani > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > Of Shelley Theye > Sent: November-22-17 2:29 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > > Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? > contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of > time. > The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really > just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat > leaves > should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, etc. from > water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. > > You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you > will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on > you?but that might be > going overboard. Definitely wash hands after handling... > > Shelley > > > > On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: > > My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact > with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted > primarily through a bite. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Theresa O'Rourke > > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) > Subject: [Felvtalk] Question > > I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. > My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a > separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean > the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of > other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch > The disease. > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 12:47:55 -0800 > From: Gloria To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > Message-ID: <84D3EC5C-F72E-4FF9-8F61-75D7CFCEC4FE at verizon.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Immune system plays a huge part-usually mature cats have a vibrant > immune system, it?s the very young or older cats that would be more at > risk, IMO. > Also, the FeLV cat?s immune system is compromised, I believe, so > contact with other cats would be something to consider for the health > of the FeLV diagnosed cat. > I have a cat diagnosed in 2010, that I strongly feel beat the > virus-(answer to Prayer) he was older when I found him, the vet > guessing him to be around 1 year old. > We keep him in our guest room with a modified door so he > ?participates? in the hall/house activities and the room is > ventilated. > I will not take him to the vet unless he becomes ill-keeping the > STRESS down so no testing! My practice is to wash my hands with > alcohol and or soap for 20 seconds > before & after I?m in his room. I keep his dishes sterile, no shared > food or water or containers- but that?s about it. > Now- this is my practice and everyone needs to follow his/her own > inner voice on this matter- just sharing - not pushing an agenda. lol > Gloria, furmommy to Buddy Luv > -g ?? > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:04 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy >> (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the >> house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >> repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with >> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >> >> Amani >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of Theresa O'Rourke >> Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a >> separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean >> the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of >> other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The >> disease. >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 17 > **************************************** > From bchapel at optonline.net Thu Nov 23 14:21:37 2017 From: bchapel at optonline.net (ROBERT CHAPEL) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 15:21:37 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Felvtalk] FeLV transmission In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <58df156.b8d7.15fea8afb8f.Webtop.39@optonline.net> to bolster what Amani wrote. Felv appears to be a minor risk for adult cats who did not get the disease from the queen at birth. It is a MAJOR risk for kittens born with the disease who still show it at 6 months. I wouldnt worry terribly about adults getting it from a kitten....would definitely worry abiut exposing kittens to a disease carrying adult OR kitten....also Caution with FIV adults On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 03:48 PM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: > Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to > felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Question (Theresa O'Rourke) > 2. Re: Question (Shelley Theye) > 3. Re: Question (Amani Oakley) > 4. Re: Question (Gloria) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:19:55 -0500 > From: Theresa O'Rourke To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > Message-ID: <12335F70-455C-490A-849A-8BADF0A69BCC at videotron.ca> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Thank you! > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 2:04 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy >> (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the >> house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >> repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with >> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >> >> Amani >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of Theresa O'Rourke >> Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a >> separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean >> the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of >> other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The >> disease. >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:28:57 -0500 > From: Shelley Theye To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? > contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of > time. > The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really > just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat > leaves should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, > etc. from water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. > > You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you > will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on > you?but that might be going overboard. Definitely wash hands after > handling... > > Shelley > >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: >> >> My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact >> with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted >> primarily through a bite. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Theresa O'Rourke To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a >> separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean >> the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of >> other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch >> The disease. >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:35:20 +0000 > From: Amani Oakley To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: Re: > [Felvtalk] Question > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > As I said ? I had a cat in with at least 8 other cats for 7 years with > no transmission. They shared food and water bowls, beds, grooming, > playing, biting, scratching - the whole nine yards. I don?t think it > is particularly contagious with older cats. > > Amani > > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf > Of Shelley Theye > Sent: November-22-17 2:29 PM > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > > Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? > contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of > time. > The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really > just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat > leaves > should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, etc. from > water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. > > You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you > will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on > you?but that might be > going overboard. Definitely wash hands after handling... > > Shelley > > > > On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: > > My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact > with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted > primarily through a bite. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Theresa O'Rourke > > To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) > Subject: [Felvtalk] Question > > I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. > My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a > separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean > the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of > other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch > The disease. > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 12:47:55 -0800 > From: Gloria To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > Message-ID: <84D3EC5C-F72E-4FF9-8F61-75D7CFCEC4FE at verizon.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Immune system plays a huge part-usually mature cats have a vibrant > immune system, it?s the very young or older cats that would be more at > risk, IMO. > Also, the FeLV cat?s immune system is compromised, I believe, so > contact with other cats would be something to consider for the health > of the FeLV diagnosed cat. > I have a cat diagnosed in 2010, that I strongly feel beat the > virus-(answer to Prayer) he was older when I found him, the vet > guessing him to be around 1 year old. > We keep him in our guest room with a modified door so he > ?participates? in the hall/house activities and the room is > ventilated. > I will not take him to the vet unless he becomes ill-keeping the > STRESS down so no testing! My practice is to wash my hands with > alcohol and or soap for 20 seconds > before & after I?m in his room. I keep his dishes sterile, no shared > food or water or containers- but that?s about it. > Now- this is my practice and everyone needs to follow his/her own > inner voice on this matter- just sharing - not pushing an agenda. lol > Gloria, furmommy to Buddy Luv > -g ?? > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:04 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy >> (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the >> house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >> repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with >> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >> >> Amani >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf >> Of Theresa O'Rourke >> Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a >> separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean >> the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of >> other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The >> disease. >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 17 > **************************************** > From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Thu Nov 23 18:25:41 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 19:25:41 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] FeLV transmission In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you Robert, I?m preparing the cat?s room with his own blankets, toys, Tower, and will clean everything well after! I?m not worrying about it like before, Because you all sent me back very good feedback and ideas! I really appreciate it! Sent from my iPad > On Nov 23, 2017, at 3:21 PM, ROBERT CHAPEL wrote: > > to bolster what Amani wrote. Felv appears to be a minor risk for adult cats who did not get the disease from the queen at birth. It is a MAJOR risk for kittens born with the disease who still show it at 6 months. I wouldnt worry terribly about adults getting it from a kitten....would definitely worry abiut exposing kittens to a disease carrying adult OR kitten....also Caution with FIV adults > > >> On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 03:48 PM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: >> >> Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to >> felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> 1. Re: Question (Theresa O'Rourke) >> 2. Re: Question (Shelley Theye) >> 3. Re: Question (Amani Oakley) >> 4. Re: Question (Gloria) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:19:55 -0500 > to bolster what Amani wrote. Felv appears to be a minor risk for adult cats who did not get the disease from the queen at birth. It is a MAJOR risk for kittens born with the disease who still show it at 6 months. I wouldnt worry terribly about adults getting it from a kitten....would definitely worry abiut exposing kittens to a disease carrying adult OR kitten....also Caution with FIV adults > > >> On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 03:48 PM, felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org wrote: >> >> Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to >> felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> felvtalk-request at felineleukemia.org >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> felvtalk-owner at felineleukemia.org >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> 1. Re: Question (Theresa O'Rourke) >> 2. Re: Question (Shelley Theye) >> 3. Re: Question (Amani Oakley) >> 4. Re: Question (Gloria) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:19:55 -0500 >> From: Theresa O'Rourke To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question >> Message-ID: <12335F70-455C-490A-849A-8BADF0A69BCC at videotron.ca> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 >> >> Thank you! >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On Nov 22, 2017, at 2:04 PM, Amani Oakley wrote: >>> >>> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >>> >>> Amani >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke >>> Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM >>> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >>> >>> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >>> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 2 >> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 14:28:57 -0500 >> From: Shelley Theye To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question >> Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of time. >> The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat leaves should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, etc. from water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. >> >> You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on you?but that might be going overboard. Definitely wash hands after handling... >> >> Shelley >> >>> On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: >>> >>> My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Theresa O'Rourke To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) >>> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >>> >>> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >>> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch >>> The disease. >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 3 >> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 19:35:20 +0000 >> From: Amani Oakley To: "felvtalk at felineleukemia.org" Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question >> Message-ID: >> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> As I said ? I had a cat in with at least 8 other cats for 7 years with no transmission. They shared food and water bowls, beds, grooming, playing, biting, scratching - the whole nine yards. I don?t think it is particularly contagious with older cats. >> >> Amani >> >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Shelley Theye >> Sent: November-22-17 2:29 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> Actually, Feline Leukemia can also be transmitted through ?friendly? contact. Sharing food/water and grooming each other over a period of time. >> The virus only lives for a few hours in the environment, so really just cleaning out the food/water bowls and litter box after the cat leaves >> should suffice, and check to see if any wet spots on floor, etc. from water or urine and disinfect just to be on the safe side. >> >> You might want to have different shoes on too? and clothes, if you will be playing with and handling the cat a lot, in case drools on you?but that might be >> going overboard. Definitely wash hands after handling... >> >> Shelley >> >> >> >> On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:03 AM, kresch831 at mchsi.com wrote: >> >> My take on this disease is that FeL is transmitted by direct contact with blood or saliva from the infected cat. The FeLV is transmitted primarily through a bite. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Theresa O'Rourke > >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Sent: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 10:14:29 -0500 (EST) >> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch >> The disease. >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 4 >> Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 12:47:55 -0800 >> From: Gloria To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question >> Message-ID: <84D3EC5C-F72E-4FF9-8F61-75D7CFCEC4FE at verizon.net> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 >> >> Immune system plays a huge part-usually mature cats have a vibrant immune system, it?s the very young or older cats that would be more at risk, IMO. >> Also, the FeLV cat?s immune system is compromised, I believe, so contact with other cats would be something to consider for the health of the FeLV diagnosed cat. >> I have a cat diagnosed in 2010, that I strongly feel beat the virus-(answer to Prayer) he was older when I found him, the vet guessing him to be around 1 year old. >> We keep him in our guest room with a modified door so he ?participates? in the hall/house activities and the room is ventilated. >> I will not take him to the vet unless he becomes ill-keeping the STRESS down so no testing! My practice is to wash my hands with alcohol and or soap for 20 seconds >> before & after I?m in his room. I keep his dishes sterile, no shared food or water or containers- but that?s about it. >> Now- this is my practice and everyone needs to follow his/her own inner voice on this matter- just sharing - not pushing an agenda. lol >> Gloria, furmommy to Buddy Luv >> -g ?? >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:04 AM, Amani Oakley wrote: >>> >>> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read repeatedly that it really isn?t that infectious, especially with adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >>> >>> Amani >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke >>> Sent: November-22-17 10:14 AM >>> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> Subject: [Felvtalk] Question >>> >>> I have three cats, and take care of other people?s cats. >>> My daughter?s friend has a FeLV positive cat, can I keep her in a separate room for a week, do I have to wash all the linens and clean the room, after the cat goes back home? It?s because I take care of other friend?s cats also and want to know if they can catch The disease. >>> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Subject: Digest Footer >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> End of Felvtalk Digest, Vol 42, Issue 17 >> **************************************** >> > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Thu Nov 23 18:34:17 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2017 19:34:17 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <85471197-CD72-4703-B361-72568A4B702B@videotron.ca> Thank you Lorrie, So happy I joined this group. I?ll keep the cat for a week, spoil him, not mix him with Other cat?s, And clean well after, The room will be left empty for 7 days after. However, I won?t do this again, Because I have other people?s cats in separate room and Won?t go through this again! ???? I?ll even change my clothes when I go in and out, But sure that is NOT NECESSARY. IF it was just my cat?s, I have three of my own, I wouldn?t be so neurotic. ? Sent from my iPad > On Nov 23, 2017, at 11:56 AM, Lorrie wrote: > > This is my experience too. I've had FelV cats who lived to be 8 or 9 > and one of my FelV cats is about 11 and still OK. These cats lived > with many other negative cats. These were adult cats... I understand > FelV is most dangerous to kittens whose immune systems are not fully > developed. > > Lorrie > >> On 11-22, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little >> boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in >> the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >> repeatedly that it really isn???t that infectious, especially with >> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >> >> Amani >> > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From ardyr at centurytel.net Wed Nov 29 05:06:21 2017 From: ardyr at centurytel.net (Ardy Robertson) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2017 05:06:21 -0600 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: <85471197-CD72-4703-B361-72568A4B702B@videotron.ca> References: <85471197-CD72-4703-B361-72568A4B702B@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <00bb01d36902$17f77220$47e65660$@centurytel.net> I always wondered about it when I took Tigger to the vet. I kept him in his carrier until we went into the exam room, but the vets never seemed concerned about spreading it to the other patients. Ardy -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 6:34 PM To: felinerescue at frontier.com; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question Thank you Lorrie, So happy I joined this group. I?ll keep the cat for a week, spoil him, not mix him with Other cat?s, And clean well after, The room will be left empty for 7 days after. However, I won?t do this again, Because I have other people?s cats in separate room and Won?t go through this again! ???? I?ll even change my clothes when I go in and out, But sure that is NOT NECESSARY. IF it was just my cat?s, I have three of my own, I wouldn?t be so neurotic. ? Sent from my iPad > On Nov 23, 2017, at 11:56 AM, Lorrie wrote: > > This is my experience too. I've had FelV cats who lived to be 8 or 9 > and one of my FelV cats is about 11 and still OK. These cats lived > with many other negative cats. These were adult cats... I understand > FelV is most dangerous to kittens whose immune systems are not fully > developed. > > Lorrie > >> On 11-22, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little >> boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in >> the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >> repeatedly that it really isn???t that infectious, especially with >> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >> >> Amani >> > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From dlgegg at windstream.net Wed Nov 29 11:16:50 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2017 11:16:50 -0600 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: <00bb01d36902$17f77220$47e65660$@centurytel.net> Message-ID: <20171129121650.CVZMP.39389.root@pamxwww04-z01> Since the vet is not worried, why should you? I thought about that when I took Annie in. ---- Ardy Robertson wrote: > I always wondered about it when I took Tigger to the vet. I kept him in his carrier until we went into the exam room, but the vets never seemed concerned about spreading it to the other patients. Ardy -----Original Message----- From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 6:34 PM To: felinerescue at frontier.com; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question Thank you Lorrie, So happy I joined this group. I?ll keep the cat for a week, spoil him, not mix him with Other cat?s, And clean well after, The room will be left empty for 7 days after. However, I won?t do this again, Because I have other people?s cats in separate room and Won?t go through this again! ???? I?ll even change my clothes when I go in and out, But sure that is NOT NECESSARY. IF it was just my cat?s, I have three of my own, I wouldn?t be so neurotic. ? Sent from my iPad > On Nov 23, 2017, at 11:56 AM, Lorrie wrote: > > This is my experience too. I've had FelV cats who lived to be 8 or 9 > and one of my FelV cats is about 11 and still OK. These cats lived > with many other negative cats. These were adult cats... I understand > FelV is most dangerous to kittens whose immune systems are not fully > developed. > > Lorrie > >> On 11-22, Amani Oakley wrote: >> >> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little >> boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in >> the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >> repeatedly that it really isn???t that infectious, especially with >> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >> >> Amani >> > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Wed Nov 29 22:39:39 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2017 23:39:39 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8601F981-A87D-4D94-9AC4-7A198104CD83@videotron.ca> Thank you, For all your wonderful responses. Sent from my iPad > On Nov 29, 2017, at 12:16 PM, dlgegg at windstream.net wrote: > > Since the vet is not worried, why should you? I thought about that when I took Annie in. > > ---- Ardy Robertson wrote: >> I always wondered about it when I took Tigger to the vet. I kept him in his carrier until we went into the exam room, but the vets never seemed concerned about spreading it to the other patients. > > Ardy > > -----Original Message----- > From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke > Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 6:34 PM > To: felinerescue at frontier.com; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > > Thank you Lorrie, > > So happy I joined this group. > I?ll keep the cat for a week, spoil him, not mix him with Other cat?s, And clean well after, The room will be left empty for 7 days after. > However, I won?t do this again, > Because I have other people?s cats in separate room and Won?t go through this again! ???? I?ll even change my clothes when I go in and out, But sure that is NOT NECESSARY. > IF it was just my cat?s, I have three of my own, I wouldn?t be so neurotic. ? > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Nov 23, 2017, at 11:56 AM, Lorrie wrote: >> >> This is my experience too. I've had FelV cats who lived to be 8 or 9 >> and one of my FelV cats is about 11 and still OK. These cats lived >> with many other negative cats. These were adult cats... I understand >> FelV is most dangerous to kittens whose immune systems are not fully >> developed. >> >> Lorrie >> >>> On 11-22, Amani Oakley wrote: >>> >>> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >>> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >>> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >>> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little >>> boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in >>> the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >>> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >>> repeatedly that it really isn???t that infectious, especially with >>> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >>> >>> Amani >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From toomanykitties2 at earthlink.net Thu Nov 30 05:35:30 2017 From: toomanykitties2 at earthlink.net (Margo) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 06:35:30 -0500 (GMT-05:00) Subject: [Felvtalk] Question Message-ID: <1579403846.314.1512041730543@wamui-napoleon.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Transmission of FeLV takes prolonged contact between cats; sharing food, water and litterboxes, and often mutual grooming. It is NOT transmitted other than by physical contact. Easiest way for me to differentiate between that and FIV transmission; "FeLV is a disease of friends, FIV is a disease of enemies" FelV spreads thru close friendly contact FIV spreads by deep bite wounds (or sexual contact, but all our animals are altered...right?) Margo -----Original Message----- >From: dlgegg at windstream.net >Sent: Nov 29, 2017 12:16 PM >To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > >Since the vet is not worried, why should you? I thought about that when I took Annie in. > >---- Ardy Robertson wrote: >> I always wondered about it when I took Tigger to the vet. I kept him in his carrier until we went into the exam room, but the vets never seemed concerned about spreading it to the other patients. > >Ardy > >-----Original Message----- >From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke >Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 6:34 PM >To: felinerescue at frontier.com; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > >Thank you Lorrie, > >So happy I joined this group. >I?ll keep the cat for a week, spoil him, not mix him with Other cat?s, And clean well after, The room will be left empty for 7 days after. >However, I won?t do this again, >Because I have other people?s cats in separate room and Won?t go through this again! ???? I?ll even change my clothes when I go in and out, But sure that is NOT NECESSARY. >IF it was just my cat?s, I have three of my own, I wouldn?t be so neurotic. ? > > >Sent from my iPad > >> On Nov 23, 2017, at 11:56 AM, Lorrie wrote: >> >> This is my experience too. I've had FelV cats who lived to be 8 or 9 >> and one of my FelV cats is about 11 and still OK. These cats lived >> with many other negative cats. These were adult cats... I understand >> FelV is most dangerous to kittens whose immune systems are not fully >> developed. >> >> Lorrie >> >>> On 11-22, Amani Oakley wrote: >>> >>> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >>> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >>> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >>> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little >>> boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in >>> the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >>> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >>> repeatedly that it really isn???t that infectious, especially with >>> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >>> >>> Amani >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From dlgegg at windstream.net Thu Nov 30 06:29:00 2017 From: dlgegg at windstream.net (dlgegg at windstream.net) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 6:29:00 -0600 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: <1579403846.314.1512041730543@wamui-napoleon.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20171130072900.4IMVR.627.root@pamxwww03-z01> Re: spay/neuter, First I give them 2 weeks for an owner to show up and then it is off to the vet for an exam and spay/neuter. I do not want to be a contributor to unwanted kittens/puppies plus they will live longer healthier lives. ---- Margo wrote: > Transmission of FeLV takes prolonged contact between cats; sharing food, water and litterboxes, and often mutual grooming. It is NOT transmitted other than by physical contact. Easiest way for me to differentiate between that and FIV transmission; "FeLV is a disease of friends, FIV is a disease of enemies" FelV spreads thru close friendly contact FIV spreads by deep bite wounds (or sexual contact, but all our animals are altered...right?) Margo -----Original Message----- >From: dlgegg at windstream.net >Sent: Nov 29, 2017 12:16 PM >To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > >Since the vet is not worried, why should you? I thought about that when I took Annie in. > >---- Ardy Robertson wrote: >> I always wondered about it when I took Tigger to the vet. I kept him in his carrier until we went into the exam room, but the vets never seemed concerned about spreading it to the other patients. > >Ardy > >-----Original Message----- >From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke >Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 6:34 PM >To: felinerescue at frontier.com; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question > >Thank you Lorrie, > >So happy I joined this group. >I?ll keep the cat for a week, spoil him, not mix him with Other cat?s, And clean well after, The room will be left empty for 7 days after. >However, I won?t do this again, >Because I have other people?s cats in separate room and Won?t go through this again! ???? I?ll even change my clothes when I go in and out, But sure that is NOT NECESSARY. >IF it was just my cat?s, I have three of my own, I wouldn?t be so neurotic. ? > > >Sent from my iPad > >> On Nov 23, 2017, at 11:56 AM, Lorrie wrote: >> >> This is my experience too. I've had FelV cats who lived to be 8 or 9 >> and one of my FelV cats is about 11 and still OK. These cats lived >> with many other negative cats. These were adult cats... I understand >> FelV is most dangerous to kittens whose immune systems are not fully >> developed. >> >> Lorrie >> >>> On 11-22, Amani Oakley wrote: >>> >>> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >>> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >>> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >>> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little >>> boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in >>> the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >>> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >>> repeatedly that it really isn???t that infectious, especially with >>> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >>> >>> Amani >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > >_______________________________________________ >Felvtalk mailing list >Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org _______________________________________________ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org From theresa.orourke at videotron.ca Thu Nov 30 10:22:27 2017 From: theresa.orourke at videotron.ca (Theresa O'Rourke) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 11:22:27 -0500 Subject: [Felvtalk] Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you Sent from my iPad > On Nov 30, 2017, at 7:29 AM, dlgegg at windstream.net wrote: > > Re: spay/neuter, First I give them 2 weeks for an owner to show up and then it is off to the vet for an exam and spay/neuter. I do not want to be a contributor to unwanted kittens/puppies plus they will live longer healthier lives. > > ---- Margo wrote: >> > Transmission of FeLV takes prolonged contact between cats; sharing food, water and litterboxes, and often mutual grooming. It is NOT transmitted other than by physical contact. > > Easiest way for me to differentiate between that and FIV transmission; > > "FeLV is a disease of friends, FIV is a disease of enemies" > > FelV spreads thru close friendly contact > > FIV spreads by deep bite wounds (or sexual contact, but all our animals are altered...right?) > > Margo > > > > -----Original Message----- >> From: dlgegg at windstream.net >> Sent: Nov 29, 2017 12:16 PM >> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> Since the vet is not worried, why should you? I thought about that when I took Annie in. >> >> ---- Ardy Robertson wrote: >>> I always wondered about it when I took Tigger to the vet. I kept him in his carrier until we went into the exam room, but the vets never seemed concerned about spreading it to the other patients. >> >> Ardy >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Theresa O'Rourke >> Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2017 6:34 PM >> To: felinerescue at frontier.com; felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Question >> >> Thank you Lorrie, >> >> So happy I joined this group. >> I?ll keep the cat for a week, spoil him, not mix him with Other cat?s, And clean well after, The room will be left empty for 7 days after. >> However, I won?t do this again, >> Because I have other people?s cats in separate room and Won?t go through this again! ???? I?ll even change my clothes when I go in and out, But sure that is NOT NECESSARY. >> IF it was just my cat?s, I have three of my own, I wouldn?t be so neurotic. ? >> >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On Nov 23, 2017, at 11:56 AM, Lorrie wrote: >>> >>> This is my experience too. I've had FelV cats who lived to be 8 or 9 >>> and one of my FelV cats is about 11 and still OK. These cats lived >>> with many other negative cats. These were adult cats... I understand >>> FelV is most dangerous to kittens whose immune systems are not fully >>> developed. >>> >>> Lorrie >>> >>>> On 11-22, Amani Oakley wrote: >>>> >>>> We had a FeLV cat who lived to age 7. No other cat in our house was >>>> infected, despite the fact that our vet initially said that the >>>> infection would decimate the house. (We had at least 8 other cats.) >>>> That was the case event though we never isolated our FeLV little >>>> boy (it would have been fairly pointless as he had already been in >>>> the house almost a year by then) and even though he played with and >>>> groomed several of the other cats in the house. I have since read >>>> repeatedly that it really isn???t that infectious, especially with >>>> adult cats. It is more of a risk with young kittens. >>>> >>>> Amani >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Felvtalk mailing list >>> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >>> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Felvtalk mailing list >> Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org >> http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Felvtalk mailing list > Felvtalk at felineleukemia.org > http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org