[Felvtalk] Amani thoughts for Winstrol

[dlgegg at windstream.net]

I really feel blessed because my vet said 2 choices, euthansia or keep Annie, treat her and hope.  I would have walked out the door and never returned if he only had one solution.  Find another vet.


---- Ardy Robertson <ardyr at centurytel.net> wrote: 
> Hello,
> 
> If I can jump in on the website idea, I believe that would help people, especially people like me who had no experience with FeLV. Suddenly you are told one of your kitties has FeLV virus, and you are being told there are no options other than euthanasia. My vets even wanted me to go home and get my other two cats and bring them in that day for euthanizing!  I said “no”!  If there was a website that sort of listed a protocol for treating the FeLV crises, that would be great! One of our vets then offered Interferon and while I was placing my hopes on that treatment, believing that the vets wanted Tigger to live and pull out of the crisis he was in, valuable time was slipping away and Tigg’s blood counts were taking a dive. They didn’t really explain anything about the blood test results.  I basically had to learn everything from reading online.  For instance I did not know that stress can bring on a crisis.  We had brought a stray into our house, and she was running up behind Tigger and biting him hard. His stress from that was high.  I also learned from reading online that while the FeLV virus spreads to other cats, it is hardly ever spread to a cat over 11 months of age because their immune system can usually defend them from it.  That is also how I found this group online.
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> It was when Amani explained that Winstrol has been shown to turn the bone marrow back on to producing blood cells, that I decided to take a chance on it. Then much more time was lost trying to find a way to get Winstrol, also known as Stanozolol.  I found a source in Canada, but they were not able to ship into the US.  I live in Wisconsin, so I had to find a source in the US.  Again, as a novice, I did not have the information I needed to make any meaningful decisions. I happen to be computer-literate so I was able to do the searching for ways to get Winstrol etc., I shudder to think what a loving cat owner who just doesn’t happen to be able to find things online easily, would do! So the need for information is critical……both for cat owners, and eventually to change the minds of the veterinary community! I hope one day, they will actually SUGGEST it to cat parents.
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> If a website could ever become a reality, I would gladly share Tigger’s treatment details, along with his blood test results. Even though we eventually lost him, I feel I was given some additional time with him – and it was good quality time with him feeling very good, and playful most of the time. I also feel he may have pulled through this particular crisis if I had started this treatment regime as soon as I knew he was FeLV positive. I could be wrong, but I think the FeLV virus sometimes sits dormant in the cat, waiting for some period of stress in the cat’s life, and then it pops up and attacks in varying ways. If the owner is able to get the cat through that particular crisis, then I think it sometimes backs off again, possibly for very long periods, especially if the cat’s stress levels can be kept low.
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> Thank you,
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> Ardy
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> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Rachel Dagner
> Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2016 10:34 AM
> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org
> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Amani thoughts for Winstrol
> 
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> I have googled you, you are the only one on here that I can put a face to a name! Can we post pictures when we send messages? 
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> Yes, not all lawyers are bad. Lol I am glad you do something you believe in and that is fulfilling and helps people. Probably makes all of the hours worth it. That and you love kitties and help people on here with theirs when you have so little time tells me you are a wonderful person with a huge heart and a beautiful soul. 
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> A web site would be awesome, somewhere to send people for information instead of having to start over completely with a new person. I know there are places where you can do free websites. I have no idea how to do one.  But I am good at researching and figuring things out, so it's something we could look at.
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> Sent from my iPhone
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> 
> On May 14, 2016, at 1:42 PM, Amani Oakley <aoakley at oakleylegal.com <mailto:aoakley at oakleylegal.com> > wrote:
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> Hi Rachel
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> I AM working today. I got up late since in fact, I was working until about 4:30 a.m. That’s one thing about working for myself (with just my husband as my partner). There is only this single perk I have and that is that I don’t get up early since I generally work all night. I figure since I’m the boss, I don’t have to justify my hours to anyone else! Of course, if I have to go to court for motions or trials, then I have to get up early like the rest of the world, but frankly, when I am in court, I generally don’t go to bed at all. Fun, eh? And to think that one of the reasons I left the field of Medical Laboratory Technology and decided to be a lawyer was that I hated having to do midnight shifts. Now, it’s not a “shift”. I’m just up ALL night and work all day TOO.
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> Rachel, what I would love to do is have someone way smarter than me when it comes to websites, develop a website where we can collect the information about Winstrol. It is absolutely essential for us to collect credible objective scientific information if we are going to convince the vets to stop their ridiculous crusade against Winstrol. At worst, the drug may end up not being very effective in a particular case, but it isn’t a demon drug to be avoided at all costs, and frankly, I suspect that starting the Winstrol sooner would likely give the best outcome. I think, generally speaking, that when Winstrol is finally used, the cat is in pretty bad shape, all else has failed, and we are asking for a miracle. I have a lot of faith in Winstrol, but I know full well it doesn’t always work. However, I have used it and gotten amazing results in circumstances where the vets have told me that there is nothing they have to offer, and nothing will work. So why not try the Winstrol? I simply don’t get the reluctance.
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> I would love to get Winstrol for everyone and I am trying to keep track of anyone who lets me know they have used it and how they obtained it. Unfortunately, often people will not respond with that information when I ask. Perhaps they suddenly wonder if I am a fed, posing as a cat-lover to trap unwary online folks, looking to save their babies. And I wouldn’t want to expose my vet to criticism from colleagues. I think she is less of a skeptic than most, because I let her know what I have seen, but she came in mid-way during my ordeal with Zander. She wasn’t the first vet who diagnosed him and she never saw how bad he was because by then, I was at the ER clinic. However, she allowed me to try various medications regimes, and allowed me to take the weekly blood work while I assessed the different treatment modalities to determine what was working and what wasn’t. She saw Zander improve and was extremely impressed, but you know, once he recovered from what was deemed to be a death sentence, and after there was some daylight between the crisis and his current excellent condition, vets started to suggest to me that maybe it wasn’t FeLV after all. REALLY frustrating. There is no way to convince someone who insists on not being convinced – even with weekly lab results in hand and before and after lab results. Anyway, all that to say that if push comes to shove, I think my vet believes that the Winstrol saved Zander, but if confronted by other vets, I am sure she would temper her comments so she doesn’t appear foolish and out of step to them. 
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> Ardy was generous with her information about where she was able to obtain the Winstrol and shared it with everyone, and it seems to me that this may be the most promising route. The trouble isn’t getting the Winstrol once you have a prescription – the problem is getting that prescription from your vet. Once you have that, you can order the medication online from a compounding pharmacy and Ardy let us know about the one she used which shipped to her from another state.
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> I think each of us who wants to try out the Winstrol, needs to have a talk with our vets, and explain to them that they are providing little in the way of options except euthanasia, and a trial of Winstrol is inexpensive and certainly not painful to the cat, so rather than simply putting the cat down, why not trying the Winstrol. Tell them that you understand the risk of liver damage, and again, given the alternative, you accept and recognize that risk but it is your understanding that while the liver enzymes often rise with the use of Winstrol, there is no evidence or scientific trials linking the use of Winstrol to any lasting liver damage. In the end, you are in charge. Of course the vet can refuse to provide the Winstrol and can decide he/she doesn’t want you for a client, so remain calm and not belligerent if you want to avoid that outcome. I would like to think that most vets, when faced with a logical, measured decision to try a specific course of treatment, would assist even if you don’t have their full support on the chosen treatment.
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> I think that once we have some helpful vet names, these also can be shared so people know where they can go where they will get the support they need for their FeLV cats. If anyone is situated near Toronto, Ontario, Canada, I am happy to provide them with my vet’s name and location. She is very kind, really cares about my cats, and respects my input very much, so we get along just fine. I have moved away from where the clinic is located and now have to travel close to an hour to take my cats there, but I just feel up to going through the same battle with another vet right now, so I’ll stick to the ones who have known me for decades and respect my decisions.
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> Remember too that I used a number of medications with the Winstrol. I used prednisone, Winstrol, metoclopramide (Zander seemed to have problems passing stool for a while and research online shows that FeLV affects the intestinal walls as well – metoclopramide was VERY helpful to get the stool moving regularly and I believe without the stool sitting still in one area of the intestinal tract, it took away the environment which encouraged the intestinal walls to be attacked and become inflamed), and Doxycycline. When I was trying help Ardy with Tigger, her vet wanted Tigger on Convenia and so as to “pick our battles”, I told Ardy to accept the Convenia instead of the Doxycyclne and we would play it by ear. I knew of course that antibiotics don’t kill viruses, and I couldn’t remember why Doxycycline was so important. I figured I had used it for covering for potential secondary infections. However, after seeing some blasts showing up on the blood work, I reconsidered and remembered that Doxycycline actually works to block RNA synthesis, which is how the virus reproduces, so while the Winstrol was working to restore progenitor cells in the bone marrow to get new blood cells produced, the Doxycycline was blocking the virus from continuing to reproduce unchecked. 
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> And Rachel – I am not “that” kind of a lawyer, so I can’t defend you from a drug charge, but I do have contacts across the U.S., so I promise to get you help should you end up in trouble because of my preaching about Winstrol:). I am a medical malpractice lawyer - Google me – I figured I would put my scientific and medical knowledge to good use when I left the medical field behind.
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> See – not all lawyers are bad!
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> Amani
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> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-bounces at felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Rachel Dagner
> Sent: May-14-16 7:48 AM
> To: felvtalk at felineleukemia.org <mailto:felvtalk at felineleukemia.org> 
> Subject: [Felvtalk] Amani thoughts for Winstrol
> 
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> Good Morning Amani,
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> I hope you are not working today, lawyers need QOL too!
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> I have been thinking about Winstrol and how hard it is for people to get their vets to get on board and how hard it is to find it. So I was thinking that maybe since you are the go to person for those of us looking to go this route, you could start a file of those who have tried it along with blood test results and notes or letters from vets, along with places we find that make Winstrol. You could then send the file to people to take with them to their vets. The more vets that try it and see results the more likely they are to try it again and share their experience with other vets. 
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> My second option would be that I could become a Winstrol kitty drug dealer, and if I got caught you could defend me. Then we could write a book about it.
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> Option one sounds a little more promising though.
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> Rachel 
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> Sent from my iPhone
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